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This is a pretty extreme stance. Supermarket bread is real bread, box cakes are real cakes, etc... Refining a recipe in a lab, to better meet some criteria does

This is a pretty extreme stance. Supermarket bread is real bread, box cakes are real cakes, etc... Refining a recipe in a lab, to better meet some criteria doesn’t make something not bread. That’s a bit like saying Nikes aren’t real shoes because they weren’t made by a wise old Italian cobbler over a period of 3 months. There’s fairly obvious qualitative difference between a handmade sourdough and a loaf of supermarket bread, but they’re both bread. Also, it’s pretty easy to make a fantastic, lovingly crafted loaf of bread by hand that ends up having more than 2% sugar.

YeGoblynQueenne 6y ago
I think what's extreme is the amount of extraneous ingredients that are added to sliced "bread". These recipes are not "refined" to meet any criteria that have to do with quality of the product- they're only there to improve the ability of the product to return a profit. In any case, let me be clear: I didn't say anything about Nikes not being true shoes. My comment is about fake bread. I also didn't say anything about who makes bread and for how long it's made. My comment is about ingredients added to fake bread that are not needed to make bread and are only needed to produce a product of inferior quality to true bread so that this product can be sold at a cut price and displace true bread in consumers' baskets etc.
- AmericanChopper 6y ago
  > These recipes are not "refined" to meet any criteria that have to do with quality of the product This comment is just ignorant of how modern food science works. All of the ingredients in mass-produced bread exist to improve the quality of the product. They exist to improve the texture (try recreating that texture at home, you won’t be able to), to improve the moisture content, to improve the nutritional value (eg, all of the vitamins added to fortified flour), and to improve the shelf life. You’re free to not like it, and it would be reasonable to say it’s not ‘traditional bread’. But traditional bread didn’t contain yeast monocultures either, so most breads won’t meet that standard. What you have is a very niche opinion, and it would be equally valid to say that adding extraneous ingredients like seeds or yeast makes something ‘fake bread’.
  - YeGoblynQueenne 6y ago
    >> They exist to improve the texture (try recreating that texture at home, you won’t be able to), to improve the moisture content, to improve the nutritional value (eg, all of the vitamins added to fortified flour), and to improve the shelf life. I don't need to recreate the texture of fake bread. I can make my own bread and it has a great texture that is exactly like the texture of the bread I've eaten all of my life, straight from the baker's. I don't know why you need to improve the moisture content of bread either, the moisture content of real bread is just fine. As to fortifying bread with vitamins- why ever would I need that? I eat plenty of vegetables and fruit, as well as meat and pulses and so on and I don't need my diet supplemented with vitamins in bread, of all things. As to shelf life, the only reason that fake bread lasts longer is so that it can stay on the shelf longer and be sold for longer. I don't care about that, neither does anyone I know. Like I say it's only meant to maximise the seller's profit. Like I say in my other comment, fake bread is fake and real bread is real and I'm afraid that the only reason we're having this conversation is because fake food is so common it's taken the place of real food and many people think it's normal. It isn't- it's overprocessed shit of the lowest possible quality. Also, please note that I never said anything about seeds, or yeasts, etc, ingredients that are common in real bread.
    - AmericanChopper 6y ago
      I see we've narrowed your definition of "fake bread" down to "bread that's different from the bread I prefer to eat". Also, just to point out a factual error. Most of the sliced bread in the supermarket is sold the same day it’s baked. The added shelf life is so that it lasts longer once you’ve taken it home. I personally love to bake, but I don’t bake bread that often because I can’t eat a loaf of homemade bread before it goes stale.
      - YeGoblynQueenne 6y ago
        >> I see we've narrowed your definition of "fake bread" down to "bread that's different from the bread I prefer to eat". What an awful conversational style. I specifically said that sliced bread in particular is fake bread, not that the bread I don't like to eat is fake bread. You keep over-interpreting my comments and coming up with things I never said. And what you say about fake bread being baked the day it is sold is wrong, or at least it is in my neck of the woords (the UK).

YeGoblynQueenne 6y ago

I think what's extreme is the amount of extraneous ingredients that are added to sliced "bread". These recipes are not "refined" to meet any criteria that have to do with quality of the product- they're only there to improve the ability of the product to return a profit. In any case, let me be clear: I didn't say anything about Nikes not being true shoes. My comment is about fake bread. I also didn't say anything about who makes bread and for how long it's made. My comment is about ingredients added to fake bread that are not needed to make bread and are only needed to produce a product of inferior quality to true bread so that this product can be sold at a cut price and displace true bread in consumers' baskets etc.

AmericanChopper 6y ago
> These recipes are not "refined" to meet any criteria that have to do with quality of the product This comment is just ignorant of how modern food science works. All of the ingredients in mass-produced bread exist to improve the quality of the product. They exist to improve the texture (try recreating that texture at home, you won’t be able to), to improve the moisture content, to improve the nutritional value (eg, all of the vitamins added to fortified flour), and to improve the shelf life. You’re free to not like it, and it would be reasonable to say it’s not ‘traditional bread’. But traditional bread didn’t contain yeast monocultures either, so most breads won’t meet that standard. What you have is a very niche opinion, and it would be equally valid to say that adding extraneous ingredients like seeds or yeast makes something ‘fake bread’.
- YeGoblynQueenne 6y ago
  >> They exist to improve the texture (try recreating that texture at home, you won’t be able to), to improve the moisture content, to improve the nutritional value (eg, all of the vitamins added to fortified flour), and to improve the shelf life. I don't need to recreate the texture of fake bread. I can make my own bread and it has a great texture that is exactly like the texture of the bread I've eaten all of my life, straight from the baker's. I don't know why you need to improve the moisture content of bread either, the moisture content of real bread is just fine. As to fortifying bread with vitamins- why ever would I need that? I eat plenty of vegetables and fruit, as well as meat and pulses and so on and I don't need my diet supplemented with vitamins in bread, of all things. As to shelf life, the only reason that fake bread lasts longer is so that it can stay on the shelf longer and be sold for longer. I don't care about that, neither does anyone I know. Like I say it's only meant to maximise the seller's profit. Like I say in my other comment, fake bread is fake and real bread is real and I'm afraid that the only reason we're having this conversation is because fake food is so common it's taken the place of real food and many people think it's normal. It isn't- it's overprocessed shit of the lowest possible quality. Also, please note that I never said anything about seeds, or yeasts, etc, ingredients that are common in real bread.
  - AmericanChopper 6y ago
    I see we've narrowed your definition of "fake bread" down to "bread that's different from the bread I prefer to eat". Also, just to point out a factual error. Most of the sliced bread in the supermarket is sold the same day it’s baked. The added shelf life is so that it lasts longer once you’ve taken it home. I personally love to bake, but I don’t bake bread that often because I can’t eat a loaf of homemade bread before it goes stale.
    - YeGoblynQueenne 6y ago
      >> I see we've narrowed your definition of "fake bread" down to "bread that's different from the bread I prefer to eat". What an awful conversational style. I specifically said that sliced bread in particular is fake bread, not that the bread I don't like to eat is fake bread. You keep over-interpreting my comments and coming up with things I never said. And what you say about fake bread being baked the day it is sold is wrong, or at least it is in my neck of the woords (the UK).