5 ms·

IANAL, but I'm fairly certain that's already the case today - except the "magic sentence" is a physically mailed "please cancel my account" letter sent by USPS

IANAL, but I'm fairly certain that's already the case today - except the "magic sentence" is a physically mailed "please cancel my account" letter sent by USPS with signed-delivery to the company's registered head office address. All registered companies in all US states must respond to bona-fide customer correspondence sent to their registered address. It's just unfortunate that mailing a physical letter is such a pain. It could be worse: it was only 4 years ago I needed to cancel my HVAC installation with Sears Home Services and invoked my right to cancel the contract under WA law - and Sears required me to send an actual telegram (yes, the old-school, hand-delivered, all-caps short text messages) to their head-office address. I used this company: https://www.americantelegram.com/timedatestamp.php https://www.americantelegram.com/timedatestamp.php - to send it (and yes, it worked and I got out of the contract). But wow. I don't know how this can possibly be legal as it places an unnecessary undue burden on consumers unless there's some archaic legal carve-out for telegrams specifically?

lmilcin 6y ago
I think if the company allows the client enter into contractual obligation by phone it should also be possible to invoke the cancellation part of the contract the same way. These days we get into so many contractual obligations (I can't even count the number of different subscription services I use) exactly because it is easy to make them and the law should protect users by preventing companies from making it hard to cancel it. So, if a company allows the client to create a contract by phone or Internet, it should also be easy to cancel it the same way.
- pishpash 6y ago
  Or just information would be sufficient. I'd like to know the walkthrough for backing out of a contract as experienced by an actual person before I sign.
derefr 6y ago
Obviously, there should be a SaaS API for sending templated physical-mail cancellation letters. The company could even keep a notary on staff to notarize everything they send at no extra cost.
- kube-system 6y ago
  There are a good number of APIs that will mail physical letters, pretty sure they’ve been a thing since the dot com bubble.
- anamexis 6y ago
  There was a startup called AirPaper that would do this for cancelling Comcast, $5/pop. It's no longer around, which I know because I was trying to look them up the last time I needed to cancel Comcast.
TedDoesntTalk 6y ago
> All registered companies in all US states must respond to bona-fide customer correspondence sent to their registered address. I’ve never heard of such a law before, but if one exists, it would be individual state law since corporations are incorporated at the state level. Do you have a link for this?
- DaiPlusPlus 6y ago
  > but if one exists, it would be individual state law since corporations are incorporated at the state level. Correct. My understanding is that every state has an equivalent law. I can't give any citations really, though - my own state (WA) buries the responsibilities and requirements for registered business' registered or agent addresses in multiple separate sections in the state law website.
  - TedDoesntTalk 6y ago
    Every state requires a registered agent with address within the state. But that is not the same thing as requiring a business to reply to correspondence.
    - tachyonbeam 6y ago
      Yeah, if that was the case you could snail mail DDoS them.
      - hunter2_ 6y ago
        Not if only bona fide requests need a response. If it came before a judge, you'd need each of those requests to mention valid actions regarding valid accounts without absurd/abusive redundancy.
        Strilanc 6y ago
        They'd have to open and read the bad requests to filter them out and find the good requests.
rorykoehler 6y ago
Hasn't anyone made a Saas for this?
zachrose 6y ago
How does the company verify that the sender is the customer?
sgustard 6y ago
My company's head office has been vacant for six months while everyone works from home. Nobody's reading the mail. No wonder our cancellations are way down.
- unnouinceput 6y ago
  Then what happens when people stop paying for said accounts? To my understanding once sent and deliver confirmed, as a client, that's all I have to do. Try to sue for not paying the service and I have USPS confirmation of said letter. Easy day in court for the client.
  - chrisweekly 6y ago
    "Easy day in court for the client." no such thing exists; having to go to court at all is an expensive hassle
    - DaiPlusPlus 6y ago
      Assuming you also aren't bound by how-on-earth-is-this-legal binding arbitration agreements.
awongh 6y ago
I see this telegram company is using php. Nothing against php but I love it when technology from different centuries comes together.
himinlomax 6y ago
> It's just unfortunate that mailing a physical letter is such a pain. In France you can send a registered letter from the post office's website for just a few euros. Upload your PDF, they print it, deliver it and email you a receipt when it's done. For a little more you can request a signature from the recipient. Since they keep a copy and record, it acts as a cheap form of notarization and is valid for many legal purposes.

lmilcin 6y ago

I think if the company allows the client enter into contractual obligation by phone it should also be possible to invoke the cancellation part of the contract the same way. These days we get into so many contractual obligations (I can't even count the number of different subscription services I use) exactly because it is easy to make them and the law should protect users by preventing companies from making it hard to cancel it. So, if a company allows the client to create a contract by phone or Internet, it should also be easy to cancel it the same way.

pishpash 6y ago
Or just information would be sufficient. I'd like to know the walkthrough for backing out of a contract as experienced by an actual person before I sign.

derefr 6y ago

Obviously, there should be a SaaS API for sending templated physical-mail cancellation letters. The company could even keep a notary on staff to notarize everything they send at no extra cost.

kube-system 6y ago
There are a good number of APIs that will mail physical letters, pretty sure they’ve been a thing since the dot com bubble.
anamexis 6y ago
There was a startup called AirPaper that would do this for cancelling Comcast, $5/pop. It's no longer around, which I know because I was trying to look them up the last time I needed to cancel Comcast.

TedDoesntTalk 6y ago

> All registered companies in all US states must respond to bona-fide customer correspondence sent to their registered address. I’ve never heard of such a law before, but if one exists, it would be individual state law since corporations are incorporated at the state level. Do you have a link for this?

DaiPlusPlus 6y ago
> but if one exists, it would be individual state law since corporations are incorporated at the state level. Correct. My understanding is that every state has an equivalent law. I can't give any citations really, though - my own state (WA) buries the responsibilities and requirements for registered business' registered or agent addresses in multiple separate sections in the state law website.
- TedDoesntTalk 6y ago
  Every state requires a registered agent with address within the state. But that is not the same thing as requiring a business to reply to correspondence.
  - tachyonbeam 6y ago
    Yeah, if that was the case you could snail mail DDoS them.
    - hunter2_ 6y ago
      Not if only bona fide requests need a response. If it came before a judge, you'd need each of those requests to mention valid actions regarding valid accounts without absurd/abusive redundancy.
      - Strilanc 6y ago
        They'd have to open and read the bad requests to filter them out and find the good requests.

rorykoehler 6y ago

Hasn't anyone made a Saas for this?

zachrose 6y ago

How does the company verify that the sender is the customer?

sgustard 6y ago

My company's head office has been vacant for six months while everyone works from home. Nobody's reading the mail. No wonder our cancellations are way down.

unnouinceput 6y ago
Then what happens when people stop paying for said accounts? To my understanding once sent and deliver confirmed, as a client, that's all I have to do. Try to sue for not paying the service and I have USPS confirmation of said letter. Easy day in court for the client.
- chrisweekly 6y ago
  "Easy day in court for the client." no such thing exists; having to go to court at all is an expensive hassle
  - DaiPlusPlus 6y ago
    Assuming you also aren't bound by how-on-earth-is-this-legal binding arbitration agreements.

awongh 6y ago

I see this telegram company is using php. Nothing against php but I love it when technology from different centuries comes together.

himinlomax 6y ago

> It's just unfortunate that mailing a physical letter is such a pain. In France you can send a registered letter from the post office's website for just a few euros. Upload your PDF, they print it, deliver it and email you a receipt when it's done. For a little more you can request a signature from the recipient. Since they keep a copy and record, it acts as a cheap form of notarization and is valid for many legal purposes.