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I really hope this is true. Nothing frustrates me more than how much being in the top 50 matters, combined with how easy (if expensive) it is to game. Weighti

by kogir 16y ago

I really hope this is true. Nothing frustrates me more than how much being in the top 50 matters, combined with how easy (if expensive) it is to game. Weighting anonymous, real usage information would be a huge boon and make rankings infinitely more useful. Though I suppose it's only a matter of time until that too is gamed.

gyardley 16y ago
Oh, I'm almost certain it's true. Apple has always been uncomfy with the pay-per-install business. Unfortunately that was one of the only measureable ways to cost-effectively market iOS apps. Now the best strategy is to try and curry favor with Apple and get a front-of-iTunes promotional slot. Good for Apple but pretty unpredictable for developers.
- prassarkar 16y ago
  > try and curry favor with Apple and get a front-of-iTunes promotional slot This works in the favor of big name brands who probably have a open sales channel through iAds which makes it easier for them to get promoted. It sucks for indie app developers who have limited ways of getting noticed by the Apple editorial team.
mike_h 16y ago
Usefulness is complex: "top 50" was a hack that made sense in a small and novel app world; it makes little sense now that so many tastes are represented in the iOS user base. Pay-per-install is one way to shake more material into view and see if it sticks. Apple makes money (and users benefit) by putting new material in front of eyeballs. They're going to be very careful about how they tweak the rankings.
nhangen 16y ago
Well, for someone like me, spending a few $ per day was an inexpensive way to push my app into the charts so that people see it in search. The system is gamed, but not by the little guys. It's the big studios that do it.
jobu 16y ago
This doesn't solve anything. The "problem" is that it's very difficult to match people up with apps they will like. Apple gives you two options: 1)search box 2)look at the Top lists The search box is horrendous, and makes it difficult to find an app even if you already know the name. The top lists contain a few gems, but are mostly filled with crap I would never use (especially the free). The companies "gaming" the top free list were trying to work within this framework to get their apps out there and noticed. Some apps do well and stay on the list organically after the install campaigns, and others drop like a rock. I don't think these install campaigns are a great option, but there isn't a better marketing tool at this time. The best thing Apple can do to combat this is improve their search interface.
- glhaynes 16y ago
  There are also many featured (top-billed, "New and Noteworthy", "Staff Favorites", etc) apps and, at least on the iPad, there's a "Genius" function that recommends apps based on what's on your device already. I agree the store could be considerably better, though.
- zefhous 16y ago
  Actually, Apple also provides a "Genius" section on the iPhone App Store app. It's been around for a while, but I don't think they've put it in iTunes or pushed it very hard. But yes, in general I agree with your assessment of the problem.

by kogir 16y ago

gyardley 16y ago

Oh, I'm almost certain it's true. Apple has always been uncomfy with the pay-per-install business. Unfortunately that was one of the only measureable ways to cost-effectively market iOS apps. Now the best strategy is to try and curry favor with Apple and get a front-of-iTunes promotional slot. Good for Apple but pretty unpredictable for developers.

prassarkar 16y ago
> try and curry favor with Apple and get a front-of-iTunes promotional slot This works in the favor of big name brands who probably have a open sales channel through iAds which makes it easier for them to get promoted. It sucks for indie app developers who have limited ways of getting noticed by the Apple editorial team.

mike_h 16y ago

Usefulness is complex: "top 50" was a hack that made sense in a small and novel app world; it makes little sense now that so many tastes are represented in the iOS user base. Pay-per-install is one way to shake more material into view and see if it sticks. Apple makes money (and users benefit) by putting new material in front of eyeballs. They're going to be very careful about how they tweak the rankings.

nhangen 16y ago

Well, for someone like me, spending a few $ per day was an inexpensive way to push my app into the charts so that people see it in search. The system is gamed, but not by the little guys. It's the big studios that do it.

jobu 16y ago

This doesn't solve anything. The "problem" is that it's very difficult to match people up with apps they will like. Apple gives you two options: 1)search box 2)look at the Top lists The search box is horrendous, and makes it difficult to find an app even if you already know the name. The top lists contain a few gems, but are mostly filled with crap I would never use (especially the free). The companies "gaming" the top free list were trying to work within this framework to get their apps out there and noticed. Some apps do well and stay on the list organically after the install campaigns, and others drop like a rock. I don't think these install campaigns are a great option, but there isn't a better marketing tool at this time. The best thing Apple can do to combat this is improve their search interface.

glhaynes 16y ago
There are also many featured (top-billed, "New and Noteworthy", "Staff Favorites", etc) apps and, at least on the iPad, there's a "Genius" function that recommends apps based on what's on your device already. I agree the store could be considerably better, though.
zefhous 16y ago
Actually, Apple also provides a "Genius" section on the iPhone App Store app. It's been around for a while, but I don't think they've put it in iTunes or pushed it very hard. But yes, in general I agree with your assessment of the problem.