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Gas cost isn’t a great stand in for car trip prices, as there are a plenty of other costs to drivers. The IRS per mileage reimbursement rate is 57.5 cents per

Gas cost isn’t a great stand in for car trip prices, as there are a plenty of other costs to drivers. The IRS per mileage reimbursement rate is 57.5 cents per mile, putting the “real” cost to an 800 mile roundtrip around $400. A different stand in might be the per mile rate I can get from a rental company, which is often around 20 cents a mile. That would be $160 in other costs + the $53 in gas $213. Now, people chronically underestimate the cost of driving (and many of them are fixed costs) so the “competitiveness” of rail doesn’t really change, but IMO we shouldn’t just look at gas costs for automobile transport.

DiogenesKynikos 6y ago
In Germany, the state rail company (Deutsche Bahn) tries to address this problem by selling rail discount cards. The idea is that people only take into account fuel costs when considering driving. They don't typically take into account capital costs like depreciation. So the DB sells a 250 Euro card that gives you a 50% discount on tickets for a year. The card creates an artificial sunk cost, and lowers the marginal cost of taking the train, making it more comparable with driving.
- NanoCoaster 6y ago
  > So the DB sells a 250 Euro card that gives you a 50% discount on tickets for a year. A nitpick that's so small as to almost be irrelevant: For people up to (and including) the age of 26, it's actually 60€/year. This makes going by train a financially pretty attractive travel method.
- kuschku 6y ago
  Or even the 100, which retails at 3878€ (2nd class)/6560€ (1st class) a year and allows pretty much unlimited travel, forever, everywhere.
- vinay427 6y ago
  The SBB equivalent is Switzerland is even cheaper! 165-185 CHF/year (a bit lower in EUR) and now it's cheaper for younger passengers, which means many people get it without really thinking about it because it almost inevitably pays back even with many local transport tickets or certainly intercity travel. A few trips from Zurich to Geneva would mostly or completely offset the cost depending on your ticket.
lotsofpulp 6y ago
These too are just the financial costs of driving, they don’t account for the long term environmental costs.
pdonis 6y ago
> people chronically underestimate the cost of driving (and many of them are fixed costs) Once someone has paid the fixed cost of owning a car, that cost is sunk and shouldn't be factored into calculations for individual trips. The only thing that matters at that point is marginal cost. For public transportation to be competitive, the overall public transportation system has to provide a level of service that makes it feasible for many people to not own a car at all. For example, having great inter-city train service doesn't help if I need a car to get to the train station. If I have to own the car anyway, and the marginal cost of driving is lower than the marginal cost of taking the train, I'm going to drive. In most European countries, the overall public transportation system does provide this level of service. In most places in the US, it doesn't. A significant part of the reason for that is simply that people in Europe and people in the US have a different mix of preferences. Many more people in the US do not want to live in population dense areas that can support a public transportation system that makes it feasible to not own a car. (I'm one of them: I have lived in population dense areas and I know from experience that I prefer not to.)

DiogenesKynikos 6y ago

In Germany, the state rail company (Deutsche Bahn) tries to address this problem by selling rail discount cards. The idea is that people only take into account fuel costs when considering driving. They don't typically take into account capital costs like depreciation. So the DB sells a 250 Euro card that gives you a 50% discount on tickets for a year. The card creates an artificial sunk cost, and lowers the marginal cost of taking the train, making it more comparable with driving.

NanoCoaster 6y ago
> So the DB sells a 250 Euro card that gives you a 50% discount on tickets for a year. A nitpick that's so small as to almost be irrelevant: For people up to (and including) the age of 26, it's actually 60€/year. This makes going by train a financially pretty attractive travel method.
kuschku 6y ago
Or even the 100, which retails at 3878€ (2nd class)/6560€ (1st class) a year and allows pretty much unlimited travel, forever, everywhere.
vinay427 6y ago
The SBB equivalent is Switzerland is even cheaper! 165-185 CHF/year (a bit lower in EUR) and now it's cheaper for younger passengers, which means many people get it without really thinking about it because it almost inevitably pays back even with many local transport tickets or certainly intercity travel. A few trips from Zurich to Geneva would mostly or completely offset the cost depending on your ticket.

lotsofpulp 6y ago

These too are just the financial costs of driving, they don’t account for the long term environmental costs.

pdonis 6y ago

> people chronically underestimate the cost of driving (and many of them are fixed costs) Once someone has paid the fixed cost of owning a car, that cost is sunk and shouldn't be factored into calculations for individual trips. The only thing that matters at that point is marginal cost. For public transportation to be competitive, the overall public transportation system has to provide a level of service that makes it feasible for many people to not own a car at all. For example, having great inter-city train service doesn't help if I need a car to get to the train station. If I have to own the car anyway, and the marginal cost of driving is lower than the marginal cost of taking the train, I'm going to drive. In most European countries, the overall public transportation system does provide this level of service. In most places in the US, it doesn't. A significant part of the reason for that is simply that people in Europe and people in the US have a different mix of preferences. Many more people in the US do not want to live in population dense areas that can support a public transportation system that makes it feasible to not own a car. (I'm one of them: I have lived in population dense areas and I know from experience that I prefer not to.)