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Haha I guess you don't fall into the bucket of knowing how the game works can bring some measure of inner peace. A cool related read, https://www.ribbonfarm.co

Haha I guess you don't fall into the bucket of knowing how the game works can bring some measure of inner peace. A cool related read, https://www.ribbonfarm.com/2009/11/11/the-gervais-principle-ii-posturetalk-powertalk-babytalk-and-gametalk/ https://www.ribbonfarm.com/2009/11/11/the-gervais-principle-..., sounds like you're referring to "posture talk" in that context. That whole series might be interesting to you as well, especially in relation to organizational trust expectations. I think for me, if I really did care about expectations of org trust and morality as must-haves vs. nice to haves, beyond must-have legality standards, the civil service calls, right? I wish the corporate beast didn't call for such pragmatism, and I'd be a lot less at peace if I didn't see really good operators make it to the top using their own tolerable measure of this behavior (as in personally, ethically, and competently good). Anyway, I feel you! I guess I can only cycle back to my last point: > it's an interesting quirk because this is important stuff to pick up on for good, talented, non-A-Hole peopl who do want to find a way to do good in existing corporate structure. But it's naturally sort of a toxic underbelly of work culture, and many are opposed to learning it.

courtf 6y ago
> I'd be a lot less at peace if I didn't see really good operators make it to the top using their own tolerable measure of this behavior Fair points here, and I do think the amount of disgust generated by this environment varies considerably by individual. One thing that contributes to that feeling of disgust for me is that being authentic hasn't always come easily. If you are someone who has had to hide aspects of yourself for your own safety, or perhaps worked to overcome some mental illness, it can be a hard pill to swallow to go back in the metaphorical closest just to earn brownie points, but I digress :). I've read your link before as well, and unfortunately I must count myself among the losers, at least so far. I've been clueless and even attempted some minor stabs at sociopathy (as defined at the link), but without much success.
- dogman144 6y ago
  That's a great point. There is a fair bit of encouragement leading towards behaving as one's authentic self.... but suddenly in the private sector arena, which really matters for life quality, it suddenly is the wrong advice. I've had some trouble navigating that turn as well, fwiw.
klenwell 6y ago
That Gervais Principle series, and the Company Hierarchy chart that opens it, was one of the first things that came to mind when I read this article. My takeaway from the Gervais Principle: the only way to win, if you're not a sociopath, is to be a loser. I've made my peace with that fact. Or, well, a little more positively: just try to avoid the whole corporate rat race all together. But it often has a way of finding you as this great HN comment, which was actually the first thing that came to mind, explains: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18003253 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18003253
- dogman144 6y ago
  Great read, I've been digging into it the last two hours. It was analysis I figured was out there but had trouble finding. Perhaps I'm a Jim-like reluctant sociopath s/
- botzi2001 6y ago
  I just realized that the author of the comment you point to is also the author of the FA. Wanted to point it out to others.
  - klenwell 6y ago
    Interesting. I didn't make the connection. Or, well, I guess I did.

courtf 6y ago

> I'd be a lot less at peace if I didn't see really good operators make it to the top using their own tolerable measure of this behavior Fair points here, and I do think the amount of disgust generated by this environment varies considerably by individual. One thing that contributes to that feeling of disgust for me is that being authentic hasn't always come easily. If you are someone who has had to hide aspects of yourself for your own safety, or perhaps worked to overcome some mental illness, it can be a hard pill to swallow to go back in the metaphorical closest just to earn brownie points, but I digress :). I've read your link before as well, and unfortunately I must count myself among the losers, at least so far. I've been clueless and even attempted some minor stabs at sociopathy (as defined at the link), but without much success.

dogman144 6y ago
That's a great point. There is a fair bit of encouragement leading towards behaving as one's authentic self.... but suddenly in the private sector arena, which really matters for life quality, it suddenly is the wrong advice. I've had some trouble navigating that turn as well, fwiw.

klenwell 6y ago

That Gervais Principle series, and the Company Hierarchy chart that opens it, was one of the first things that came to mind when I read this article. My takeaway from the Gervais Principle: the only way to win, if you're not a sociopath, is to be a loser. I've made my peace with that fact. Or, well, a little more positively: just try to avoid the whole corporate rat race all together. But it often has a way of finding you as this great HN comment, which was actually the first thing that came to mind, explains: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18003253 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18003253

dogman144 6y ago
Great read, I've been digging into it the last two hours. It was analysis I figured was out there but had trouble finding. Perhaps I'm a Jim-like reluctant sociopath s/
botzi2001 6y ago
I just realized that the author of the comment you point to is also the author of the FA. Wanted to point it out to others.
- klenwell 6y ago
  Interesting. I didn't make the connection. Or, well, I guess I did.