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Some of us grew up in a mild socialist/communist regime, in where leaders thought they can more wisely spend the fruit of your labour than yourself. So we emigr

by aries1980 6y ago

Some of us grew up in a mild socialist/communist regime, in where leaders thought they can more wisely spend the fruit of your labour than yourself. So we emigrated to a country that supposed to be free. In the UK, a middle class earner already pays 40% income tax + 20% VAT + 13.8% NI, that's a neat 73.8% to the community already (not to mention the extra taxes, like the Council Tax or extra duties when you pour a gin). The labour wanted to increase this by 5-25 percentage point. What is communism, if not the political ruling that strips the common people to build up wealth?

dkdbejwi383 6y ago
> What is communism, if not the political ruling that strips the common people to build up wealth? That sounds like capitalism to me. > In the UK, a middle class earner already pays 40% income tax + 20% VAT + 13.8% NI, that's a neat 73.8% to the community already (not to mention the extra taxes, like the Council Tax or extra duties when you pour a gin). The labour wanted to increase this by 5-25 percentage point. I am a very middle-class earner and I'd very happily pay more tax if it went to funding the NHS, metal health programs, real addition treatment (not criminalisation of addicts), house building, arts programs. In fact I have consistently voted for this. Your post insinuates that these taxes are just taken with nothing gained. I am happy to pay council tax because I know that pays for services I benefit from, like rubbish collection, parks and landscape maintenance, street cleaning, etc. I am happy to pay duty on alcohol because I know it is an addictive substance, and although I don't suffer from addiction, others do, and in order for me to freely consume alcohol I have to accept that as a society we have to pay for those to do suffer because of it. I am happy to pay income tax and NI because I use NHS services, I went to a state funded school, I use the railways, etc.
- aries1980 6y ago
  > That sounds like capitalism to me. Capitalism encourages private ownership and keeping the means of your labour. High taxation is the opposite of this, because it doesn't leave enough profit at the individual, which prevents private ownership. > Your post insinuates that these taxes are just taken with nothing gained. That's not true. Just because to me the current and Labour-proposed level of taxation is not motivating to do more doesn't mean some level of taxation is not necessary. It is not all or nothing. > I have to accept that as a society we have to pay for those to do suffer because of it. This is the fundamental difference from our point-of-view. I look at free and adult individuals as who are responsible for their actions and can be held accountable.
silveroriole 6y ago
Your figures are obviously wrong... tax is not 40% over your entire earnings and VAT is not taken from your salary. So this “omg, government take 75% of my earnings!” thing is alarmist. e: in fact if you earn 80k and spend ALL your takehome on 20% VAT goods, you still end up with the majority share.
- aries1980 6y ago
  > in fact if you earn 80k and spend ALL your takehome on 20% VAT goods, you still end up with the majority share. Employment salary cost: 91.04K (gross salary + employer's national insurance) Gross income: 80K Take home pay: 55.04K VAT: 11K The value you can get if you buy everyday items after your 91K salary cost is 44K or 48%, the rest, 47K goes to the treasury. My figures were wrong indeed.

dkdbejwi383 6y ago

> What is communism, if not the political ruling that strips the common people to build up wealth? That sounds like capitalism to me. > In the UK, a middle class earner already pays 40% income tax + 20% VAT + 13.8% NI, that's a neat 73.8% to the community already (not to mention the extra taxes, like the Council Tax or extra duties when you pour a gin). The labour wanted to increase this by 5-25 percentage point. I am a very middle-class earner and I'd very happily pay more tax if it went to funding the NHS, metal health programs, real addition treatment (not criminalisation of addicts), house building, arts programs. In fact I have consistently voted for this. Your post insinuates that these taxes are just taken with nothing gained. I am happy to pay council tax because I know that pays for services I benefit from, like rubbish collection, parks and landscape maintenance, street cleaning, etc. I am happy to pay duty on alcohol because I know it is an addictive substance, and although I don't suffer from addiction, others do, and in order for me to freely consume alcohol I have to accept that as a society we have to pay for those to do suffer because of it. I am happy to pay income tax and NI because I use NHS services, I went to a state funded school, I use the railways, etc.

aries1980 6y ago
> That sounds like capitalism to me. Capitalism encourages private ownership and keeping the means of your labour. High taxation is the opposite of this, because it doesn't leave enough profit at the individual, which prevents private ownership. > Your post insinuates that these taxes are just taken with nothing gained. That's not true. Just because to me the current and Labour-proposed level of taxation is not motivating to do more doesn't mean some level of taxation is not necessary. It is not all or nothing. > I have to accept that as a society we have to pay for those to do suffer because of it. This is the fundamental difference from our point-of-view. I look at free and adult individuals as who are responsible for their actions and can be held accountable.

silveroriole 6y ago

Your figures are obviously wrong... tax is not 40% over your entire earnings and VAT is not taken from your salary. So this “omg, government take 75% of my earnings!” thing is alarmist. e: in fact if you earn 80k and spend ALL your takehome on 20% VAT goods, you still end up with the majority share.

aries1980 6y ago
> in fact if you earn 80k and spend ALL your takehome on 20% VAT goods, you still end up with the majority share. Employment salary cost: 91.04K (gross salary + employer's national insurance) Gross income: 80K Take home pay: 55.04K VAT: 11K The value you can get if you buy everyday items after your 91K salary cost is 44K or 48%, the rest, 47K goes to the treasury. My figures were wrong indeed.