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This matters for senior management only, i.e. those who make decisions. This doesn't matter for middle management (even though they act as if they are senior ma

by ry454 6y ago

This matters for senior management only, i.e. those who make decisions. This doesn't matter for middle management (even though they act as if they are senior managers) and that's completely irrelevant for line workers who don't need to "read body language" to get their linear work done.

Pfhreak 6y ago
Line engineers totally need to read body language. Presenting a paper or design? You need to read when your audience is drifting. Discussing a contentious code review? Body language can tell you loads about how much they are committed to their approach. Mentoring other engineers? Running an ops review? Asking for approval for something? There's a million scenarios where understanding body language makes you a more successful line engineer.
- dimnsionofsound 6y ago
  Another great reason I want to continue working remote: Why would I want to leak any information in my body language to coworkers or management? I have no idea what they are going to do with said information, and the fact that I'm not already saying whatever it is my body language is communicating means that I would not like to supply it.
  - Pfhreak 6y ago
    > I have no idea what they are going to do with said information... Typically, try to make sure that you are comfortable? Humans communicate nonverbally, just like most social animals.
RestlessMind 6y ago
> This doesn't matter for middle management Umm what? Based on my 15+ year experience in tech sector (similar for my partner), my take is that in-person interaction is absolutely necessary for the middle management layer (though certainly not sufficient). They need to interact with both the bosses and the trench soldiers. If everything else is held constant (same org, same talent, same level, same effort), an in-office middle manager will absolutely outperform a similar person in a remote setup. I'd go even one step further and say that in-person interaction is critical not only for middle managers but also for those individual contributors who want to jump to management or tech-lead positions.

by ry454 6y ago

Pfhreak 6y ago

Line engineers totally need to read body language. Presenting a paper or design? You need to read when your audience is drifting. Discussing a contentious code review? Body language can tell you loads about how much they are committed to their approach. Mentoring other engineers? Running an ops review? Asking for approval for something? There's a million scenarios where understanding body language makes you a more successful line engineer.

dimnsionofsound 6y ago
Another great reason I want to continue working remote: Why would I want to leak any information in my body language to coworkers or management? I have no idea what they are going to do with said information, and the fact that I'm not already saying whatever it is my body language is communicating means that I would not like to supply it.
- Pfhreak 6y ago
  > I have no idea what they are going to do with said information... Typically, try to make sure that you are comfortable? Humans communicate nonverbally, just like most social animals.

RestlessMind 6y ago

> This doesn't matter for middle management Umm what? Based on my 15+ year experience in tech sector (similar for my partner), my take is that in-person interaction is absolutely necessary for the middle management layer (though certainly not sufficient). They need to interact with both the bosses and the trench soldiers. If everything else is held constant (same org, same talent, same level, same effort), an in-office middle manager will absolutely outperform a similar person in a remote setup. I'd go even one step further and say that in-person interaction is critical not only for middle managers but also for those individual contributors who want to jump to management or tech-lead positions.