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> In the UK expressing politically incorrect opinion about genders may turn an otherwise successful writer into an outlaw. "an outlaw", really? This might be

> In the UK expressing politically incorrect opinion about genders may turn an otherwise successful writer into an outlaw. "an outlaw", really? This might be one of the most hyperbolic statements I've ever seen. The uproar about JK Rowling is not equivalent to the treatment of "blasphemers" in the Soviet Union, give me a break.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
AlexTWithBeard 6y ago
> The uproar about JK Rowling is not equivalent to the treatment of "blasphemers" in the Soviet Union Which one do you see as being worse (and why?)
- lostlogin 6y ago
  Maybe a brief read up on gulags, knowing what got you there and what happened might help you.
- tikhonj 6y ago
  You mean comparing the one where a car with its headlights off turns up at your apartment around midnight and you're never seen again to one where you're a billionaire who gets angry comments on Twitter and, maybe, a non-material reduction in ongoing revenue from a work you finished years ago?
- chki 6y ago
  Is this a serious question? Are you comparing actual executions to the treatment of Rowling on Twitter? You must be trolling.
  - AlexTWithBeard 6y ago
    Ok, now I see where you're coming from. In the original post I was talking about the late (no pun intended) Soviet Union: 1960 onwards. You were not executed for political jokes. You will just be shunned by your friends and won't be offered any decent job and your kids may never get into the college.
- sbmthakur 6y ago
  In the Soviet Union, the "blasphemers" were actually tried in a show trial, which sent them to labor camps. All they did was to write satire that did not go well with the state. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinyavsky%E2%80%93Daniel_trial https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinyavsky%E2%80%93Daniel_trial
  - gambiting 6y ago
    The point everyone seems to be missing here is that it's not like if you said something bad about the party then bam, off to the labour camps you went. The entire Soviet Union would be one huge labour camp if that was the case. That would happen to you if you somehow got published in a newspaper being critical of the government. Or if you were say a headmaster of a school or the director of a state owned company - then yeah, the punishment would be pretty severe. But your regular Joe making a bad comment at the wrong time? You'd definitely lose your job first, few phone calls to the right place and it would happen. Or maybe you got a mandatory re-assignment to a middle of bumfuck nowhere. Not a labour camp, just the same job you were doing already, but in a small town out thousands of km away from your family. Or maybe you were waiting in a queue to get a flat assigned to you - well, that's not happening anymore. Like, my point is, there were escalating punishments to criticizing the government. Some people here suggest that it was like "say something bad about the government = black volga picks you up and you disappear forever". It wasn't that unless you had certain amount of outreach.
gambiting 6y ago
JK Rowling is already a millionare, she can make pretty much any unpopular opinion on twitter or elswhere and apart from the outrage almost nothing will happen to her. She might stop being invited to some events, boo hoo. If you or me posted on twitter that(as an example!!!) people shouldn't be free to pick their own gender and I'm like 99% certain I'd get fired or at least reprimended at work, and I'm sure finding further work would be difficult. And I think you might be a little bit off the mark, because I do actually come from a formely communist country - and yeah, making unpopular statements against the ruling party wouldn't throw you in prison(at least not straight away) but you can guarantee most jobs would fire you on the spot and you'd have problems finding any further work. It's not as different as you think.
- lostlogin 6y ago
  > If you or me posted on twitter that(as an example!!!) people shouldn't be free to pick their own gender and I'm like 99% certain I'd get fired or at least reprimended at work, and I'm sure finding further work would be difficult. I think you overestimate the reach of Twitter and the number of jobs that trawl employee and potential employee Twitter post history.
  - gambiting 6y ago
    Possibly, but I also think that it's not so unlikely that some "kind soul" would quickly find out where I work and tag them in a reply saying "you need to fire this guy". Then it gets picked up by our PR department and it's all downhill from there. It's possible that it wouldn't have such a large impact on looking for a new job I guess.
manfredo 6y ago
I'm not sure what the above poster means by "outlaw", but yes police do investigate and have sometimes issued fines for public statements that don't invite violence or harass but espouse unpopular views: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-humber-47005937 https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-humber-47005937. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/arrests-offensive-facebook-and-twitter-posts-soar-london-a7064246.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/arrests-offensive-face... This isn't just JK Rowling getting a Twitter backlash, it's being enforced by police.
blfr 6y ago
YouTuber was arrested and convicted in Britain for teaching his dog to do a nazi salute. It's not a ten year sentence for 13-year old but still a very real legal sanction. https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/youtuber-count-dankula-found-guilty-of-hate-crime-for-teaching-pet-pug-nazi-salute-a3794926.html https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/youtuber-count-dankula...
snovv_crash 6y ago
If this is what happens to billionaires, what is the treatment given to a nobody?

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

AlexTWithBeard 6y ago

> The uproar about JK Rowling is not equivalent to the treatment of "blasphemers" in the Soviet Union Which one do you see as being worse (and why?)

lostlogin 6y ago
Maybe a brief read up on gulags, knowing what got you there and what happened might help you.
tikhonj 6y ago
You mean comparing the one where a car with its headlights off turns up at your apartment around midnight and you're never seen again to one where you're a billionaire who gets angry comments on Twitter and, maybe, a non-material reduction in ongoing revenue from a work you finished years ago?
chki 6y ago
Is this a serious question? Are you comparing actual executions to the treatment of Rowling on Twitter? You must be trolling.
- AlexTWithBeard 6y ago
  Ok, now I see where you're coming from. In the original post I was talking about the late (no pun intended) Soviet Union: 1960 onwards. You were not executed for political jokes. You will just be shunned by your friends and won't be offered any decent job and your kids may never get into the college.
sbmthakur 6y ago
In the Soviet Union, the "blasphemers" were actually tried in a show trial, which sent them to labor camps. All they did was to write satire that did not go well with the state. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinyavsky%E2%80%93Daniel_trial https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinyavsky%E2%80%93Daniel_trial
- gambiting 6y ago
  The point everyone seems to be missing here is that it's not like if you said something bad about the party then bam, off to the labour camps you went. The entire Soviet Union would be one huge labour camp if that was the case. That would happen to you if you somehow got published in a newspaper being critical of the government. Or if you were say a headmaster of a school or the director of a state owned company - then yeah, the punishment would be pretty severe. But your regular Joe making a bad comment at the wrong time? You'd definitely lose your job first, few phone calls to the right place and it would happen. Or maybe you got a mandatory re-assignment to a middle of bumfuck nowhere. Not a labour camp, just the same job you were doing already, but in a small town out thousands of km away from your family. Or maybe you were waiting in a queue to get a flat assigned to you - well, that's not happening anymore. Like, my point is, there were escalating punishments to criticizing the government. Some people here suggest that it was like "say something bad about the government = black volga picks you up and you disappear forever". It wasn't that unless you had certain amount of outreach.

gambiting 6y ago

JK Rowling is already a millionare, she can make pretty much any unpopular opinion on twitter or elswhere and apart from the outrage almost nothing will happen to her. She might stop being invited to some events, boo hoo. If you or me posted on twitter that(as an example!!!) people shouldn't be free to pick their own gender and I'm like 99% certain I'd get fired or at least reprimended at work, and I'm sure finding further work would be difficult. And I think you might be a little bit off the mark, because I do actually come from a formely communist country - and yeah, making unpopular statements against the ruling party wouldn't throw you in prison(at least not straight away) but you can guarantee most jobs would fire you on the spot and you'd have problems finding any further work. It's not as different as you think.

lostlogin 6y ago
> If you or me posted on twitter that(as an example!!!) people shouldn't be free to pick their own gender and I'm like 99% certain I'd get fired or at least reprimended at work, and I'm sure finding further work would be difficult. I think you overestimate the reach of Twitter and the number of jobs that trawl employee and potential employee Twitter post history.
- gambiting 6y ago
  Possibly, but I also think that it's not so unlikely that some "kind soul" would quickly find out where I work and tag them in a reply saying "you need to fire this guy". Then it gets picked up by our PR department and it's all downhill from there. It's possible that it wouldn't have such a large impact on looking for a new job I guess.

manfredo 6y ago

I'm not sure what the above poster means by "outlaw", but yes police do investigate and have sometimes issued fines for public statements that don't invite violence or harass but espouse unpopular views: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-humber-47005937 https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-humber-47005937. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/arrests-offensive-facebook-and-twitter-posts-soar-london-a7064246.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/arrests-offensive-face... This isn't just JK Rowling getting a Twitter backlash, it's being enforced by police.

blfr 6y ago

YouTuber was arrested and convicted in Britain for teaching his dog to do a nazi salute. It's not a ten year sentence for 13-year old but still a very real legal sanction. https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/youtuber-count-dankula-found-guilty-of-hate-crime-for-teaching-pet-pug-nazi-salute-a3794926.html https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/youtuber-count-dankula...

snovv_crash 6y ago

If this is what happens to billionaires, what is the treatment given to a nobody?