6 ms·

I agree - the media constantly posts these “other countries look at USA in bewilderment” articles as if anyone in the US should care what others think. I’m cons

I agree - the media constantly posts these “other countries look at USA in bewilderment” articles as if anyone in the US should care what others think. I’m constantly amazed that Europe has insanely high taxes, low growth, and tiny innovation yet no one every speaks of my bewilderment. Everyone has cool stuff, but there are bad things to say about every country in addition to good things.

ggm 6y ago
as if anyone in the US should care what others think. American exceptionalism in one phrase.
- kortilla 6y ago
  Germans don’t care what New Yorkers think about Germany. A news article about Americans taking pity on Germany would never land in Der Spiegel but we don’t call that German exceptionalism.
  - bobthepanda 6y ago
    Germans may not care specifically about New Yorkers' every thought about their country but they do compare their results internationally. Here's a Der Spiegel article about how the German PISA results are good but could be better: https://www.spiegel.de/lebenundlernen/schule/pisa-studie-der-oecd-deutschland-landet-im-oberen-mittelfeld-a-1299249.html https://www.spiegel.de/lebenundlernen/schule/pisa-studie-der...
  - corty 6y ago
    Oh, there is plenty of German exceptionalism, it usually takes the form of moral, political or ethical snobbiness. Germany views itself as an exceptionally moral and civilized nation nowadays and strives to export that lesson from the past. Not only the Nazi past, mind you, the saying "Am Deutschen Wesen soll die Welt genesen" -German habit shall heal the world- is far older. Germans know they might be smaller or average in most things, but morally and ethically, we are Übermenschen...
- AniseAbyss 6y ago
  If only it went both ways.
pertymcpert 6y ago
Maybe try living there? I have in both. Life is definitely better in Western Europe.
- seibelj 6y ago
  Ah yes, the “true happiness is simply moving to another country” argument. The truth is that life is what you make of it - the happiness you seek cannot be provided by any government. Plenty of people are happy and plenty of people are empty, sad, unfulfilled, and depressed in every country on earth. That said, I will prefer to live in places that give me more choice - more economic choice, more living choices, more everything choices. I am by any global metric a wealthy person and my US tax rate is very low compared to every other western nation except for tax shelter countries. And I prefer to have less government mandating where my wealth is spent and retain more control over my life. What’s so wonderful is that apparently anyone (just like yourself!) can so easily uproot their entire lives to experiment living in two different countries! Although research tells me that Scandinavian countries, The Netherlands, and France have very difficult requirements for immigration. I need to learn Dutch? Huh? In the USA it’s so much easier!
  - supportlocal4h 6y ago
    I'm a bit unclear about your ending. You want to move to the Netherlands but don't want to learn Dutch? Are you one of those Californians who are desperate to escape California but then try to change all the rules of your new home to match what you had in California? Just so you know, this is very irritating to your new neighbors. I live in the USA. I like it here. But you say it is better because it has lower taxes and doesn't make you learn Dutch. Others point out that your taxes + your health insurance premiums + doctor fees are not less than Netherland's taxes that include healthcare. When I lived outside the USA I made a significant effort to learn the language. I've never understood why one would not. If these are your main reasons for preferring the USA they seem pretty weak. Your first paragraph is a much stronger position.
    - seibelj 6y ago
eecc 6y ago
Well, not everywhere in Europe has insanely high taxes and for a fair comparison I’d add what Americans pay in health insurance anyway. As for high growth, Europe doesn’t have the space to engage in pump & dump real estate and the same scale of military subsidies that made the fortunes of many US industries.
iso947 6y ago
Looking at 90%ile total income tax in UK it’s about the same as 90%ile in a typical US state, but you get comprehensive health care in UK
- waterheater 6y ago
  If there's any common political rallying point in the USA, it's how expensive healthcare is! Relief does exist. I know two close people who each had around $70k of medical debt wiped clean by hospitals. But yes, healthcare costs need to drop. See this graph for a symptom of why healthcare is so expensive: http://www.ibj.com/ext/resources/blog/The-Dose/Physicians-Administrators.png http://www.ibj.com/ext/resources/blog/The-Dose/Physicians-Ad...
  - bumby 6y ago
    What’s interesting is that two sectors that have had costs rising much faster than inflation for decades are healthcare and college in the US. Replace “physicians” with “professors” and you have a visually identical graph for college costs

ggm 6y ago

as if anyone in the US should care what others think. American exceptionalism in one phrase.

kortilla 6y ago
Germans don’t care what New Yorkers think about Germany. A news article about Americans taking pity on Germany would never land in Der Spiegel but we don’t call that German exceptionalism.
- bobthepanda 6y ago
  Germans may not care specifically about New Yorkers' every thought about their country but they do compare their results internationally. Here's a Der Spiegel article about how the German PISA results are good but could be better: https://www.spiegel.de/lebenundlernen/schule/pisa-studie-der-oecd-deutschland-landet-im-oberen-mittelfeld-a-1299249.html https://www.spiegel.de/lebenundlernen/schule/pisa-studie-der...
- corty 6y ago
  Oh, there is plenty of German exceptionalism, it usually takes the form of moral, political or ethical snobbiness. Germany views itself as an exceptionally moral and civilized nation nowadays and strives to export that lesson from the past. Not only the Nazi past, mind you, the saying "Am Deutschen Wesen soll die Welt genesen" -German habit shall heal the world- is far older. Germans know they might be smaller or average in most things, but morally and ethically, we are Übermenschen...
AniseAbyss 6y ago
If only it went both ways.

pertymcpert 6y ago

Maybe try living there? I have in both. Life is definitely better in Western Europe.

seibelj 6y ago
Ah yes, the “true happiness is simply moving to another country” argument. The truth is that life is what you make of it - the happiness you seek cannot be provided by any government. Plenty of people are happy and plenty of people are empty, sad, unfulfilled, and depressed in every country on earth. That said, I will prefer to live in places that give me more choice - more economic choice, more living choices, more everything choices. I am by any global metric a wealthy person and my US tax rate is very low compared to every other western nation except for tax shelter countries. And I prefer to have less government mandating where my wealth is spent and retain more control over my life. What’s so wonderful is that apparently anyone (just like yourself!) can so easily uproot their entire lives to experiment living in two different countries! Although research tells me that Scandinavian countries, The Netherlands, and France have very difficult requirements for immigration. I need to learn Dutch? Huh? In the USA it’s so much easier!
- supportlocal4h 6y ago
  I'm a bit unclear about your ending. You want to move to the Netherlands but don't want to learn Dutch? Are you one of those Californians who are desperate to escape California but then try to change all the rules of your new home to match what you had in California? Just so you know, this is very irritating to your new neighbors. I live in the USA. I like it here. But you say it is better because it has lower taxes and doesn't make you learn Dutch. Others point out that your taxes + your health insurance premiums + doctor fees are not less than Netherland's taxes that include healthcare. When I lived outside the USA I made a significant effort to learn the language. I've never understood why one would not. If these are your main reasons for preferring the USA they seem pretty weak. Your first paragraph is a much stronger position.
  - seibelj 6y ago

eecc 6y ago

Well, not everywhere in Europe has insanely high taxes and for a fair comparison I’d add what Americans pay in health insurance anyway. As for high growth, Europe doesn’t have the space to engage in pump & dump real estate and the same scale of military subsidies that made the fortunes of many US industries.

iso947 6y ago

Looking at 90%ile total income tax in UK it’s about the same as 90%ile in a typical US state, but you get comprehensive health care in UK

waterheater 6y ago
If there's any common political rallying point in the USA, it's how expensive healthcare is! Relief does exist. I know two close people who each had around $70k of medical debt wiped clean by hospitals. But yes, healthcare costs need to drop. See this graph for a symptom of why healthcare is so expensive: http://www.ibj.com/ext/resources/blog/The-Dose/Physicians-Administrators.png http://www.ibj.com/ext/resources/blog/The-Dose/Physicians-Ad...
- bumby 6y ago
  What’s interesting is that two sectors that have had costs rising much faster than inflation for decades are healthcare and college in the US. Replace “physicians” with “professors” and you have a visually identical graph for college costs