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It is a country. The only reason it wouldn’t be recognized as such is related to the pressure China puts on other countries to not do so. Much in the same way

It is a country. The only reason it wouldn’t be recognized as such is related to the pressure China puts on other countries to not do so. Much in the same way they pressure other countries to ignore the abuses of Uighurs and Tibetans.

FooBarWidget 6y ago
I am confused about what it is that you're trying to achieve with this attitude. My point is that international law and international relations are at play, and that they matter. If you are so convinced about Taiwan, you really should do two things: 1. Convince the DPP to officially declare independence. Not just unofficially flirting with the idea, but officially still claiming all of China. 2. After 1 has happened, convince UN members to recognize Taiwan. From a legal process point of view, I think 2 cannot happen until 1 is done.
- CameronNemo 6y ago
  I do not believe that the UN is the arbiter of who is and is not a country. And Taiwan should avoid doing anything that might provoke the CCP (like declaring independence without consulting with the CCP first).
  - FooBarWidget 6y ago
    Perhaps not. But when it comes to UN institutions and their processes, they follow the official UN list of recognized nations. And legally, how do you recognize a country that does not officially recognize itself? The Taiwanese constitution still says it is the Republic of China. The current legal situation is that, by recognizing Taiwan, you are officially saying that the Taiwanese government is the legit ruler of the mainland.
- ardy42 6y ago
  > I am confused about what it is that you're trying to achieve with this attitude. My point is that international law and international relations are at play, and that they matter. Taiwan is de facto an independent country in every way you could possibly conceive, including having de jure diplomatic relations with a few countries and de facto relations with many more. In international relations, actions matter more than words, and in Taiwan's case, those actions indicate that it's an independent country. The only reason official declarations stating the obvious haven't been made is due to the threats and coercion conducted by the PRC. The presence of those threats makes the absence of the declarations literally meaningless. It's sort of like being forced to sign a contract under duress.

FooBarWidget 6y ago

I am confused about what it is that you're trying to achieve with this attitude. My point is that international law and international relations are at play, and that they matter. If you are so convinced about Taiwan, you really should do two things: 1. Convince the DPP to officially declare independence. Not just unofficially flirting with the idea, but officially still claiming all of China. 2. After 1 has happened, convince UN members to recognize Taiwan. From a legal process point of view, I think 2 cannot happen until 1 is done.

CameronNemo 6y ago
I do not believe that the UN is the arbiter of who is and is not a country. And Taiwan should avoid doing anything that might provoke the CCP (like declaring independence without consulting with the CCP first).
- FooBarWidget 6y ago
  Perhaps not. But when it comes to UN institutions and their processes, they follow the official UN list of recognized nations. And legally, how do you recognize a country that does not officially recognize itself? The Taiwanese constitution still says it is the Republic of China. The current legal situation is that, by recognizing Taiwan, you are officially saying that the Taiwanese government is the legit ruler of the mainland.
ardy42 6y ago
> I am confused about what it is that you're trying to achieve with this attitude. My point is that international law and international relations are at play, and that they matter. Taiwan is de facto an independent country in every way you could possibly conceive, including having de jure diplomatic relations with a few countries and de facto relations with many more. In international relations, actions matter more than words, and in Taiwan's case, those actions indicate that it's an independent country. The only reason official declarations stating the obvious haven't been made is due to the threats and coercion conducted by the PRC. The presence of those threats makes the absence of the declarations literally meaningless. It's sort of like being forced to sign a contract under duress.