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I think coverage of Facebook is often too US-heavy and it really misses the point by making it into a US partisan issue - this article mentions Trump but doesn'

by mcintyre1994 6y ago

I think coverage of Facebook is often too US-heavy and it really misses the point by making it into a US partisan issue - this article mentions Trump but doesn't mention Ethiopia. Here's a Vice Article about how hate speech on Facebook is currently pushing Ethiopia toward a genocide just like it did in Myanmar a few years ago: https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/xg897a/hate-speech-on-facebook-is-pushing-ethiopia-dangerously-close-to-a-genocide%C2%A0 https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/xg897a/hate-speech-on-fac...

croissants 6y ago
I struggle with this issue. On the one hand, I think clear incitement to violence is a line that free speech shouldn't cross, so Facebook really should have deleted posts calling for some people to be burned more quickly. On the other hand, the idea that Facebook is culpable here seems to take for granted a large chunk of Ethiopians who'll just do what they're told by Facebook posts, which seems to give very little credit to the Ethiopian people or the ability of their government to maintain order. In that sense, it feels prejudiced and patronizing, like arguing that Facebook needs to police its Ethiopian presence because Ethiopia can't police itself.
- benwad 6y ago
  IMO Facebook should be able to police its own platform, so if it has a large presence in Ethiopia then it needs to police that part of its platform (ideally using employees based in Ethiopia). If it feels it can't effectively police Ethiopian Facebook without amplifying hateful/violent messages then they shouldn't be operating there.
  - croissants 6y ago
    It makes sense to me that Facebook should attempt to follow the laws of the various countries in which it operates -- though obviously vague laws prohibiting "sedition" or "promoting unrest" make this hard. But it seems quite difficult to navigate less codified cultural topics. For example, the problems in Ethiopia turn on old lines of ethnic division. It's tough for me to imagine that Facebook will somehow arrive at a way to manage a problem that's troubled Ethiopia for so long, even (especially?) if it uses local employees as moderators.
- mcintyre1994 6y ago
  I think the implication is more that Facebook massively under-moderates and is basically unable to moderate in vast parts of the world. I think you'd see equally disastrous results if they had barely any moderators who could speak English or knew American culture and current events.
- vaccinator 6y ago
  > I think clear incitement to violence is a line that free speech shouldn't cross but either way, according to most folks on this forum, Facebook doesn't have to allow free speech
- ntsplnkv2 6y ago
  Perhaps the real issue is just that - you give people far too much credit. We're essentially animals. I mean look around you. You could say "no we can't tax sugar, cigarettes, and alcohol, because that gives the people too little credit to make good healthy choices!" And yet 42% of Americans are obese. Anti-science and anti-vax culture is very relevant. People believe Bill Gates wants to track their every move, and yet they walk around with phones and are signed into facebook trading their photoshopped memes from Russian troll farms. We give ourselves way too much credit.
facebookbadfru 6y ago
Yeah, they have been doing lot of shady things in other countries way before US criticism of it. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facebook https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facebook Read the controversial section. Even that is missing a lot and the citations are removed. Facebook has been used for genocide, mass cultural appropriation, raising anti-ism sentiment, etc by military, government and terrorists. They don't employ enough moderators likely intentionally in many regions. African continent has less than a 100.

croissants 6y ago

I struggle with this issue. On the one hand, I think clear incitement to violence is a line that free speech shouldn't cross, so Facebook really should have deleted posts calling for some people to be burned more quickly. On the other hand, the idea that Facebook is culpable here seems to take for granted a large chunk of Ethiopians who'll just do what they're told by Facebook posts, which seems to give very little credit to the Ethiopian people or the ability of their government to maintain order. In that sense, it feels prejudiced and patronizing, like arguing that Facebook needs to police its Ethiopian presence because Ethiopia can't police itself.

benwad 6y ago
IMO Facebook should be able to police its own platform, so if it has a large presence in Ethiopia then it needs to police that part of its platform (ideally using employees based in Ethiopia). If it feels it can't effectively police Ethiopian Facebook without amplifying hateful/violent messages then they shouldn't be operating there.
- croissants 6y ago
  It makes sense to me that Facebook should attempt to follow the laws of the various countries in which it operates -- though obviously vague laws prohibiting "sedition" or "promoting unrest" make this hard. But it seems quite difficult to navigate less codified cultural topics. For example, the problems in Ethiopia turn on old lines of ethnic division. It's tough for me to imagine that Facebook will somehow arrive at a way to manage a problem that's troubled Ethiopia for so long, even (especially?) if it uses local employees as moderators.
mcintyre1994 6y ago
I think the implication is more that Facebook massively under-moderates and is basically unable to moderate in vast parts of the world. I think you'd see equally disastrous results if they had barely any moderators who could speak English or knew American culture and current events.
vaccinator 6y ago
> I think clear incitement to violence is a line that free speech shouldn't cross but either way, according to most folks on this forum, Facebook doesn't have to allow free speech
ntsplnkv2 6y ago
Perhaps the real issue is just that - you give people far too much credit. We're essentially animals. I mean look around you. You could say "no we can't tax sugar, cigarettes, and alcohol, because that gives the people too little credit to make good healthy choices!" And yet 42% of Americans are obese. Anti-science and anti-vax culture is very relevant. People believe Bill Gates wants to track their every move, and yet they walk around with phones and are signed into facebook trading their photoshopped memes from Russian troll farms. We give ourselves way too much credit.

facebookbadfru 6y ago

Yeah, they have been doing lot of shady things in other countries way before US criticism of it. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facebook https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facebook Read the controversial section. Even that is missing a lot and the citations are removed. Facebook has been used for genocide, mass cultural appropriation, raising anti-ism sentiment, etc by military, government and terrorists. They don't employ enough moderators likely intentionally in many regions. African continent has less than a 100.