5 ms·

In Changing Face of Beijing, a Look at the New China

12 points by echair 18y ago

cglee 18y ago
I feel obligated to comment just because I pass by that monstrosity every day. It's not obvious from the title, but this is primarily a piece on several of Beijing's new architectural showpieces, while trying to interleave China's "growth" and "changing landscape" into the commentary. Since I don't know too much about architecture, I can't say whether it's a good article or not, but I really didn't learn much from this.
- curiousgeorge 18y ago
  I think the new CCTV building is great. That being said, I'm reminded of a comment I read ages ago. "Spend a day in China and you can write a book. Spend a few years and you can't think of a single thing to say."
  - cglee 18y ago
    I don't see how that statement relates to China specifically.
    - curiousgeorge 18y ago
      Quote was more intended at the article than your comment. :)
biohacker42 18y ago
The sensation is comparable to the epiphany that Adolf Loos, the Viennese architect, experienced when he stepped off a steamship in New York Harbor more than a century ago. He had crossed a threshold into the future; Europe, he realized, was now culturally obsolete. Man I hope China turns out a nice super power. Like a more populous Canada or something.
- deleted 18y ago
  [deleted]
- falsestprophet 18y ago
  In today's China when the government wants to make a statement, authorities round up a bunch of suspected criminals, put them on trial, and execute them. There is an appeal process. Later that day their appeals are rejected, they are taken to a trailer out back immediately, put on their knees and shot in the back of the head.
ajkirwin 18y ago
China's wonderful architecture and fast-growing cities still doesn't, for me, offset its government and its treatment of people.
- cglee 18y ago
  I'm not sure anything can "offset" those things, but you should consider a long duration stay as a first step towards understanding some of the issues around China. China faces distinctly different problems than the US on so many fronts, that it's very difficult for Americans and Westerners to appreciate even the problems, let alone propose solutions. That's not to say you can't say what's right or wrong, but wholesale condemnation doesn't even allow one to take the first step. Update: let me be more specific, since I know the hacker in all of us wants to say "give me all the variables, and I can give the optimal solution". A lot of China's issues stem from thousands of years of culture. Thousands. You can't really get a feel of the core issues without living and breathing China for a few years. And living as an exchange student for a semester in WuDaoKuo while partying in Sanlitun really doesn't count. There are libraries of books on this subject, so I can't hope to do it justice here. In summary: it's much more complicated than just "the government" or "human rights" - it's not ever just one variable in isolation being considered. ps: think of it this way: what would you say to someone who says "I dislike the US government for its treatment of Native Americans/Alaskans/Hawaiians". I'd think you'd agree, but that's not really an issue that exists in a vacuum. There's historical, cultural, temporal, etc context...and in China (just by being around for thousands of years), all of those contexts are far more complex.
  - ajkirwin 18y ago
    I'd say, "At least those problems are mostly in the past now", whereas you cannot say the same thing about China. Infact, I must admit, China isn't a country I would even feel comfortable about visiting. I am a very vocal proponent of democracies and a critic of how China treats not only its citizens, but journalists both native and foreign and how it uses its economic might to get away with things that other country get sanctioned for. Tiananmen Square was less than 20 years ago and not that much has changed, I feel.

12 points by echair 18y ago

cglee 18y ago

I feel obligated to comment just because I pass by that monstrosity every day. It's not obvious from the title, but this is primarily a piece on several of Beijing's new architectural showpieces, while trying to interleave China's "growth" and "changing landscape" into the commentary. Since I don't know too much about architecture, I can't say whether it's a good article or not, but I really didn't learn much from this.

curiousgeorge 18y ago
I think the new CCTV building is great. That being said, I'm reminded of a comment I read ages ago. "Spend a day in China and you can write a book. Spend a few years and you can't think of a single thing to say."
- cglee 18y ago
  I don't see how that statement relates to China specifically.
  - curiousgeorge 18y ago
    Quote was more intended at the article than your comment. :)

biohacker42 18y ago

The sensation is comparable to the epiphany that Adolf Loos, the Viennese architect, experienced when he stepped off a steamship in New York Harbor more than a century ago. He had crossed a threshold into the future; Europe, he realized, was now culturally obsolete. Man I hope China turns out a nice super power. Like a more populous Canada or something.

deleted 18y ago
[deleted]
falsestprophet 18y ago
In today's China when the government wants to make a statement, authorities round up a bunch of suspected criminals, put them on trial, and execute them. There is an appeal process. Later that day their appeals are rejected, they are taken to a trailer out back immediately, put on their knees and shot in the back of the head.

ajkirwin 18y ago

China's wonderful architecture and fast-growing cities still doesn't, for me, offset its government and its treatment of people.

cglee 18y ago
I'm not sure anything can "offset" those things, but you should consider a long duration stay as a first step towards understanding some of the issues around China. China faces distinctly different problems than the US on so many fronts, that it's very difficult for Americans and Westerners to appreciate even the problems, let alone propose solutions. That's not to say you can't say what's right or wrong, but wholesale condemnation doesn't even allow one to take the first step. Update: let me be more specific, since I know the hacker in all of us wants to say "give me all the variables, and I can give the optimal solution". A lot of China's issues stem from thousands of years of culture. Thousands. You can't really get a feel of the core issues without living and breathing China for a few years. And living as an exchange student for a semester in WuDaoKuo while partying in Sanlitun really doesn't count. There are libraries of books on this subject, so I can't hope to do it justice here. In summary: it's much more complicated than just "the government" or "human rights" - it's not ever just one variable in isolation being considered. ps: think of it this way: what would you say to someone who says "I dislike the US government for its treatment of Native Americans/Alaskans/Hawaiians". I'd think you'd agree, but that's not really an issue that exists in a vacuum. There's historical, cultural, temporal, etc context...and in China (just by being around for thousands of years), all of those contexts are far more complex.
- ajkirwin 18y ago
  I'd say, "At least those problems are mostly in the past now", whereas you cannot say the same thing about China. Infact, I must admit, China isn't a country I would even feel comfortable about visiting. I am a very vocal proponent of democracies and a critic of how China treats not only its citizens, but journalists both native and foreign and how it uses its economic might to get away with things that other country get sanctioned for. Tiananmen Square was less than 20 years ago and not that much has changed, I feel.