5 ms·

And the other 60% is not doing basically the same? > 40% always demonizes the 60% as sub-human violent scum One sentence later... > 40% has violent fantasies

And the other 60% is not doing basically the same? > 40% always demonizes the 60% as sub-human violent scum One sentence later... > 40% has violent fantasies of a Civil War do-over

Swenrekcah 6y ago
It's probably not true that all Trump supporters want a civil war, but to me it seems true that most/all of Trump's and the enabling Republicans actions are leading their country to either civil war or Putin-style autocracy. So why anyone would still be a supporter is beyond me. I'm a European who has been watching the last four years first in disbelief, then in optimism, then in pessimism and now in horror.
- read_if_gay_ 6y ago
  > It's probably not true that all Trump supporters want a civil war Probably? Dude. Don’t be ridiculous. Exactly this kind of demonization of the opposing political party is causing so many problems today.
  - Swenrekcah 6y ago
    That's fair. It's definitely not true. I considered changing the words but decided to keep probably since it is after all a more accurate statement (being a weaker assertion) and partly because it's more damning of his supporters I admit.
    - read_if_gay_ 6y ago
      Thanks for the thoughtful reply, cheers.
- DenisM 6y ago
  > most/all of Trump's and the enabling Republicans actions are leading their country to either civil war What exactly is the contribution of the Trump supporters to the development of the looming civil war? Provoking the opposition to commit violent acts?
  - Swenrekcah 6y ago
    I am talking about Republicans as in the party officials, not regular people. They could have investigated in good faith and taken action against Russian meddling. They could have blocked appointments of obvious partisan hacks like Barr and Kavanaugh. They could have cared about Trump not using the US foreign service and policy to line his own pockets. They could have called out and condemned Trump's pandering to the racists in his base. The bar was not high but they have completely failed it. When Trump took office, I genuinly believed Congress and the Republican party would keep him in check. Unfortunately the rot was too deep. From what I gather of the current riots, everyone has failed in containing the spread and damage. But still there, Trump insists on pouring gasoline on a fire, by visiting the sites knowingly provoking more unrest. A statesman would address the nation with grace, send someone else to sensitive sites, but he thrives on the chaos.
    - DenisM 6y ago
      I’m sorry, how is appointment of a Supreme Court justice threaten a civil war? Are you quite certain you are not blowing it out of proportion?
      - cycomanic 6y ago
        Well the obvious hipocrasy of the republicans with respect to the appointment of a supreme Court judge in an election year really does not lead to increase people trust in democracy. I encourage you to listen to the talks by republican senators when they blocked Obama from appointing a new Supreme Court judge 9 month before the election and how they are talking now (less then 3 months before an election). Particularly damning are lindsey graham's statements, he literally said as late as 2016 supreme court judges should not be appointed in an election year, we (as republicans) will not do it. You can hold my words against me. And now he supports Trump appointing a new judge. The blatant disregard for any accountability, not calling out (and support) of corruption and fascist rhetoric from trump certainly undermines democracy, if it will lead to civil war is a different question. However the rethoric from some parts of the republican party are definitely going in that direction. Hell some parts are actively supporting qanon.
DFHippie 6y ago
You should compare the antifa vs. fa fatality count sometime. It would put the "both sides are equally violent" hypothesis into some perspective. Or guns and ammo count.
- throwaway0a5e 6y ago
  How would you even begin the comparison? Seems like it would quickly devolve into subjective shitshow when deciding what gets included in each count.
  - Can_Not 6y ago
    https://www.adl.org/news/press-releases/right-wing-extremism-linked-to-every-2018-extremist-murder-in-the-us-adl-finds https://www.adl.org/news/press-releases/right-wing-extremism... It's already been researched. 50 murders vs zero in 2018, and the other years and reports have similar results.
    - read_if_gay_ 6y ago
      This is the same ADL that got this [0] emote banned from Call of Duty because “it‘s a symbol for white power”. Very unbiased source for sure. [0]: https://images.mein-mmo.de/medien/2020/07/cod-modern-warfare-warzone-emote-ok-geste-im-einsatz.jpg https://images.mein-mmo.de/medien/2020/07/cod-modern-warfare...
- read_if_gay_ 6y ago
  > fatality count If you count WW2 in, sure, but nowadays? I think very few of even the most extremist people on either side will murder for their convictions. If we’re talking political violence, we should focus on counting stuff like beatings, arson, even people getting canceled, because it usually doesn’t manifest in killings. > Or guns and ammo count. Not indicative of violence at all.

And the other 60% is not doing basically the same? > 40% always demonizes the 60% as sub-human violent scum One sentence later... > 40% has violent fantasies of a Civil War do-over

Swenrekcah 6y ago

It's probably not true that all Trump supporters want a civil war, but to me it seems true that most/all of Trump's and the enabling Republicans actions are leading their country to either civil war or Putin-style autocracy. So why anyone would still be a supporter is beyond me. I'm a European who has been watching the last four years first in disbelief, then in optimism, then in pessimism and now in horror.

read_if_gay_ 6y ago
> It's probably not true that all Trump supporters want a civil war Probably? Dude. Don’t be ridiculous. Exactly this kind of demonization of the opposing political party is causing so many problems today.
- Swenrekcah 6y ago
  That's fair. It's definitely not true. I considered changing the words but decided to keep probably since it is after all a more accurate statement (being a weaker assertion) and partly because it's more damning of his supporters I admit.
  - read_if_gay_ 6y ago
    Thanks for the thoughtful reply, cheers.
DenisM 6y ago
> most/all of Trump's and the enabling Republicans actions are leading their country to either civil war What exactly is the contribution of the Trump supporters to the development of the looming civil war? Provoking the opposition to commit violent acts?
- Swenrekcah 6y ago
  I am talking about Republicans as in the party officials, not regular people. They could have investigated in good faith and taken action against Russian meddling. They could have blocked appointments of obvious partisan hacks like Barr and Kavanaugh. They could have cared about Trump not using the US foreign service and policy to line his own pockets. They could have called out and condemned Trump's pandering to the racists in his base. The bar was not high but they have completely failed it. When Trump took office, I genuinly believed Congress and the Republican party would keep him in check. Unfortunately the rot was too deep. From what I gather of the current riots, everyone has failed in containing the spread and damage. But still there, Trump insists on pouring gasoline on a fire, by visiting the sites knowingly provoking more unrest. A statesman would address the nation with grace, send someone else to sensitive sites, but he thrives on the chaos.
  - DenisM 6y ago
    I’m sorry, how is appointment of a Supreme Court justice threaten a civil war? Are you quite certain you are not blowing it out of proportion?
    - cycomanic 6y ago
      Well the obvious hipocrasy of the republicans with respect to the appointment of a supreme Court judge in an election year really does not lead to increase people trust in democracy. I encourage you to listen to the talks by republican senators when they blocked Obama from appointing a new Supreme Court judge 9 month before the election and how they are talking now (less then 3 months before an election). Particularly damning are lindsey graham's statements, he literally said as late as 2016 supreme court judges should not be appointed in an election year, we (as republicans) will not do it. You can hold my words against me. And now he supports Trump appointing a new judge. The blatant disregard for any accountability, not calling out (and support) of corruption and fascist rhetoric from trump certainly undermines democracy, if it will lead to civil war is a different question. However the rethoric from some parts of the republican party are definitely going in that direction. Hell some parts are actively supporting qanon.

DFHippie 6y ago

You should compare the antifa vs. fa fatality count sometime. It would put the "both sides are equally violent" hypothesis into some perspective. Or guns and ammo count.

throwaway0a5e 6y ago
How would you even begin the comparison? Seems like it would quickly devolve into subjective shitshow when deciding what gets included in each count.
- Can_Not 6y ago
  https://www.adl.org/news/press-releases/right-wing-extremism-linked-to-every-2018-extremist-murder-in-the-us-adl-finds https://www.adl.org/news/press-releases/right-wing-extremism... It's already been researched. 50 murders vs zero in 2018, and the other years and reports have similar results.
  - read_if_gay_ 6y ago
    This is the same ADL that got this [0] emote banned from Call of Duty because “it‘s a symbol for white power”. Very unbiased source for sure. [0]: https://images.mein-mmo.de/medien/2020/07/cod-modern-warfare-warzone-emote-ok-geste-im-einsatz.jpg https://images.mein-mmo.de/medien/2020/07/cod-modern-warfare...
read_if_gay_ 6y ago
> fatality count If you count WW2 in, sure, but nowadays? I think very few of even the most extremist people on either side will murder for their convictions. If we’re talking political violence, we should focus on counting stuff like beatings, arson, even people getting canceled, because it usually doesn’t manifest in killings. > Or guns and ammo count. Not indicative of violence at all.