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“Denying a minority group rights shared by others” is not a political cause, it is hate, plain and simple. What if he was donating to support miscegenation? Wo

“Denying a minority group rights shared by others” is not a political cause, it is hate, plain and simple. What if he was donating to support miscegenation? Would that be over the line?

FeepingCreature 6y ago
No. Anyone should be able to support any political cause at any time. In a free society, we do not rely on force to produce morally correct behavior, except by force of state. We rely on law instead, which conversely requires complete freedom to participate in the democratic apparatus. Anything that messes with that messes with the very heart of a liberal democracy.
- pseudalopex 6y ago
  Freedom of association doesn't rely on law.
  - FeepingCreature 6y ago
    Corporations do not have unlimited freedom of association anyways. For instance, we already acknowledge that corporations can't refuse to associate with people on the basis of skin color. Saying that they could, say, fire a black CEO because otherwise their KKK customers would walk out, already doesn't fly; I don't see why it should have with Eich. I think racial equality is important, but political neutrality is at least equally important, because if that fails then liberalism is fucked, and liberalism is the best guarantor of racial equality as well.
    - pseudalopex 6y ago
      Mozilla employees, volunteers, and others used their freedom of speech to say they would exercise their freedom to dissociate from Eich if he continued to support discrimination. Eich dissociated himself from Mozilla so the others wouldn't.
      - FeepingCreature 6y ago
        Yeah, "voluntarily." Okay, let me explain that one. I know he says that, and I know Mozilla says that, but "I've decided to leave of my own accord" has simply become such a cliche that it can no longer be distinguished from firing. In any case, this mostly just supports my view that people don't understand liberalism and why we need it. When an atheist and a christian can sit down together and have a peaceful family dinner without talking about politics, despite the fact that at least one of them thinks that it's a matter of utmost moral importance that the other change his mind, this is a miracle of social cohesion that is crucial to keeping society together. And we're losing it.
srtjstjsj 6y ago
Prop 8 banned gay marriage but not gay domestic partnerships. It's a highly technical issue more nuanced than you are saying, despite the unnuanced views of many of its supporters.

“Denying a minority group rights shared by others” is not a political cause, it is hate, plain and simple. What if he was donating to support miscegenation? Would that be over the line?

FeepingCreature 6y ago

No. Anyone should be able to support any political cause at any time. In a free society, we do not rely on force to produce morally correct behavior, except by force of state. We rely on law instead, which conversely requires complete freedom to participate in the democratic apparatus. Anything that messes with that messes with the very heart of a liberal democracy.

pseudalopex 6y ago
Freedom of association doesn't rely on law.
- FeepingCreature 6y ago
  Corporations do not have unlimited freedom of association anyways. For instance, we already acknowledge that corporations can't refuse to associate with people on the basis of skin color. Saying that they could, say, fire a black CEO because otherwise their KKK customers would walk out, already doesn't fly; I don't see why it should have with Eich. I think racial equality is important, but political neutrality is at least equally important, because if that fails then liberalism is fucked, and liberalism is the best guarantor of racial equality as well.
  - pseudalopex 6y ago
    Mozilla employees, volunteers, and others used their freedom of speech to say they would exercise their freedom to dissociate from Eich if he continued to support discrimination. Eich dissociated himself from Mozilla so the others wouldn't.
    - FeepingCreature 6y ago
      Yeah, "voluntarily." Okay, let me explain that one. I know he says that, and I know Mozilla says that, but "I've decided to leave of my own accord" has simply become such a cliche that it can no longer be distinguished from firing. In any case, this mostly just supports my view that people don't understand liberalism and why we need it. When an atheist and a christian can sit down together and have a peaceful family dinner without talking about politics, despite the fact that at least one of them thinks that it's a matter of utmost moral importance that the other change his mind, this is a miracle of social cohesion that is crucial to keeping society together. And we're losing it.

srtjstjsj 6y ago

Prop 8 banned gay marriage but not gay domestic partnerships. It's a highly technical issue more nuanced than you are saying, despite the unnuanced views of many of its supporters.