5 ms·

Why does OP expect the cost of defending a lawsuit to be at least thousands of dollars? Presumably because OP isn't a lawyer, and thinks: (1) it isn't cost-eff

Why does OP expect the cost of defending a lawsuit to be at least thousands of dollars? Presumably because OP isn't a lawyer, and thinks: (1) it isn't cost-effective to learn to defense him/herself and (2) he/she would need to hire a lawyer to handle the court procedures and substantive arguments. I reject the OP's delineation of business vs. legal outright. If you're doing business on the web, you need to be able to defend yourself against C&D letters. Whether that means going to trial, settling the claim or calling the letter writer's bluff: you need to be able to do all three.

jbooth 16y ago
If you're going anywhere near a courtroom, or even anywhere near a mailbox where you would be mailing pieces of paper to a courtroom, you're into thousands of dollars. 10 relevant documents to be filed * 200 an hour = $2k, just to get out of the gate. Plus a couple hours of consultation, and a few 15 minute charges when they call you to confirm the spelling of your last name. Yes, they just did copy/paste on those docs, and yes, that's bullshit to bill you like that, but that's how lawyers work. The OP was lowballing it, even.
- fleitz 16y ago
  He's definitely low balling it, I spent an hour in court for some preliminary motions and it cost me $3500. And yeah, I had to edit their documents for them because they were so fucked up, it was like they had someone who dropped out in grade 8 writing the documents. This was basic shit like fixing the year from 208 to 2008.
  - sunchild 16y ago
    Perfect example of why I became a lawyer. You made yourself the victim of a lawyer that doesn't need to care about your satisfaction. Bar association self-regulation ensures that people like yourself continue to pour bad money after bad on lawyers. But, really, you have no one except yourself to blame. You got duped.
    - jbooth 16y ago
      So, it cost him 3500. And you could have argued it yourself for free (plus 6 figures in law school tuition, plus foregone salary for those 3 years). I think the point stands that court is very expensive. Is that controversial to anybody?
      - fleitz 16y ago
        Exactly, even if the documents weren't fucked up it would still have cost me $3500. The value in lawyers is smooth talking in court under pressure, you hire a lawyer so your decisions aren't based on emotion but rather objective advice as viewed through the law.
        sunchild 16y ago
        If you choose to pay someone to speak on your behalf, you can't also complain about the price. I recommend learning to speak for yourself.
        jbooth 16y ago
        Yeah, but you need to know civil procedure, probably highly specific to that area, to even be there with your paperwork in order. If you show up with an eloquently spoken story, a great logical case, and something that wasn't filed the right way, the judge will say "well that sucks but I'm here to enforce the law". So obviously the market will bear current prices, and you know as well as I do how billing works. Don't take it so personally.
        sunchild 16y ago
        You're speaking from a position of ignorance, and that bothers me. This isn't an area where opinions matter. Either you learn the subject matter, or you don't. If you don't, you can only blame yourself for being at the mercy of professional advisors.
      - sunchild 16y ago
- sunchild 16y ago
  I was arguing for avoiding lawyers altogether by learning the subject matter, the court procedures, and handling matters for yourself. Court filing fees are tiny. The cost of your time is the biggest cost, unless you already know copyright rules and how to handle a pro se defense. It's not rocket science. If you don't want to pay a lawyer, then do it yourself. What part of my post did you think invited an attack on lawyers generally? IAAL, so I'll just ignore the fact that you missed the point entirely, and move on.
  - jbooth 16y ago
    The premise of the article is that you think it's a credible threat of a lawsuit, either because the person's crazy or the law's really broken. If it's the type of C&D letter that you can laugh at and publicly post a silly retort to on the internet for the lulz, then yeah, go right ahead. Court filing fees may be tiny but screwing up a lawsuit because you didn't take Civil Procedure is expensive. You're saying you're a lawyer downthread.. would you really recommend DIY for any non-lawyer in any real case?
    - sunchild 16y ago
      You keep putting lawyers up on pedestals and then trying to knock them down. Your question to me implies that lawyers are such specialists that you could never be expected to do their job. You do realize that law school teaches next to nothing about the actual practice, right? The rest is learned by doing. In most courts around the world, you have the right to defend yourself. If you think your time is worth more than a lawyer's, then pay a lawyer. The whole victim routine is tired.

jbooth 16y ago

If you're going anywhere near a courtroom, or even anywhere near a mailbox where you would be mailing pieces of paper to a courtroom, you're into thousands of dollars. 10 relevant documents to be filed * 200 an hour = $2k, just to get out of the gate. Plus a couple hours of consultation, and a few 15 minute charges when they call you to confirm the spelling of your last name. Yes, they just did copy/paste on those docs, and yes, that's bullshit to bill you like that, but that's how lawyers work. The OP was lowballing it, even.

fleitz 16y ago
He's definitely low balling it, I spent an hour in court for some preliminary motions and it cost me $3500. And yeah, I had to edit their documents for them because they were so fucked up, it was like they had someone who dropped out in grade 8 writing the documents. This was basic shit like fixing the year from 208 to 2008.
- sunchild 16y ago
  Perfect example of why I became a lawyer. You made yourself the victim of a lawyer that doesn't need to care about your satisfaction. Bar association self-regulation ensures that people like yourself continue to pour bad money after bad on lawyers. But, really, you have no one except yourself to blame. You got duped.
  - jbooth 16y ago
    So, it cost him 3500. And you could have argued it yourself for free (plus 6 figures in law school tuition, plus foregone salary for those 3 years). I think the point stands that court is very expensive. Is that controversial to anybody?
    - fleitz 16y ago
      Exactly, even if the documents weren't fucked up it would still have cost me $3500. The value in lawyers is smooth talking in court under pressure, you hire a lawyer so your decisions aren't based on emotion but rather objective advice as viewed through the law.
      - sunchild 16y ago
        If you choose to pay someone to speak on your behalf, you can't also complain about the price. I recommend learning to speak for yourself.
        jbooth 16y ago
        Yeah, but you need to know civil procedure, probably highly specific to that area, to even be there with your paperwork in order. If you show up with an eloquently spoken story, a great logical case, and something that wasn't filed the right way, the judge will say "well that sucks but I'm here to enforce the law". So obviously the market will bear current prices, and you know as well as I do how billing works. Don't take it so personally.
        sunchild 16y ago
        You're speaking from a position of ignorance, and that bothers me. This isn't an area where opinions matter. Either you learn the subject matter, or you don't. If you don't, you can only blame yourself for being at the mercy of professional advisors.
    - sunchild 16y ago
sunchild 16y ago
I was arguing for avoiding lawyers altogether by learning the subject matter, the court procedures, and handling matters for yourself. Court filing fees are tiny. The cost of your time is the biggest cost, unless you already know copyright rules and how to handle a pro se defense. It's not rocket science. If you don't want to pay a lawyer, then do it yourself. What part of my post did you think invited an attack on lawyers generally? IAAL, so I'll just ignore the fact that you missed the point entirely, and move on.
- jbooth 16y ago
  The premise of the article is that you think it's a credible threat of a lawsuit, either because the person's crazy or the law's really broken. If it's the type of C&D letter that you can laugh at and publicly post a silly retort to on the internet for the lulz, then yeah, go right ahead. Court filing fees may be tiny but screwing up a lawsuit because you didn't take Civil Procedure is expensive. You're saying you're a lawyer downthread.. would you really recommend DIY for any non-lawyer in any real case?
  - sunchild 16y ago
    You keep putting lawyers up on pedestals and then trying to knock them down. Your question to me implies that lawyers are such specialists that you could never be expected to do their job. You do realize that law school teaches next to nothing about the actual practice, right? The rest is learned by doing. In most courts around the world, you have the right to defend yourself. If you think your time is worth more than a lawyer's, then pay a lawyer. The whole victim routine is tired.