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The link should be this: https://bangordailynews.com/2020/09/22/politics/ranked-choice-voting-will-be-used-in-maines-presidential-election-high-court-rules/ htt

The link should be this: https://bangordailynews.com/2020/09/22/politics/ranked-choice-voting-will-be-used-in-maines-presidential-election-high-court-rules/ https://bangordailynews.com/2020/09/22/politics/ranked-choic... Preferential voting just rewards vote buying and ginger groups, look at the recent New Zealand election. The successful economic reform incumbents were voted out by a minority party led by the ex President of the International Union of Socialist Youth with a populist party on a platform of slashing immigration.

LudwigNagasena 6y ago
I don’t see how the New Zealand example shows that “ preferential voting just rewards vote buying and ginger groups”.
- caf 6y ago
  New Zealand doesn't even use Ranked Choice / Preferential Voting (for the national parliament)! It uses MMP, where the voter gets to vote for exactly one party list and one candidate for local member. Preferences are not involved.
  - rrrrrrrrrrrryan 6y ago
    Not completely true. I worked in Wellington for a stint, and held a (mail-in) ballot from one of my friends in my own hands, and it was an absolute shitshow. Some local races absolutely used ranked choice, and not only that - you had to rank every single candidate or your vote wasn't counted. It was my friend's ballot - she was in her early 20s, and she laughed and said "no wonder nobody fucking votes." She didn't vote in the election, and it kind of stuck with me. Any election reform has to take into account the amount of work you're asking of voters, and it's what led me to eventually support approval voting over ranked systems.
    - caf 6y ago
      Yes, I was referring to the national parliamentary election, which was what seemed to be under discussion (edited to make that clear). There's also "Optional Preferential" where the formality rule is "number at least one, and as many as you like".
tdeck 6y ago
For those wondering what a "ginger group" is: > A ginger group is a formal or informal group within an organisation seeking to influence its direction and activity. The term comes from the phrase ginger up, meaning to enliven or stimulate. Ginger groups work to alter the organisation's policies, practices, or office-holders, while still supporting its general goals. Ginger groups sometimes form within the political parties of Commonwealth countries https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ginger_group?wprov=sfla1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ginger_group?wprov=sfla1

LudwigNagasena 6y ago

I don’t see how the New Zealand example shows that “ preferential voting just rewards vote buying and ginger groups”.

caf 6y ago
New Zealand doesn't even use Ranked Choice / Preferential Voting (for the national parliament)! It uses MMP, where the voter gets to vote for exactly one party list and one candidate for local member. Preferences are not involved.
- rrrrrrrrrrrryan 6y ago
  Not completely true. I worked in Wellington for a stint, and held a (mail-in) ballot from one of my friends in my own hands, and it was an absolute shitshow. Some local races absolutely used ranked choice, and not only that - you had to rank every single candidate or your vote wasn't counted. It was my friend's ballot - she was in her early 20s, and she laughed and said "no wonder nobody fucking votes." She didn't vote in the election, and it kind of stuck with me. Any election reform has to take into account the amount of work you're asking of voters, and it's what led me to eventually support approval voting over ranked systems.
  - caf 6y ago
    Yes, I was referring to the national parliamentary election, which was what seemed to be under discussion (edited to make that clear). There's also "Optional Preferential" where the formality rule is "number at least one, and as many as you like".

tdeck 6y ago

For those wondering what a "ginger group" is: > A ginger group is a formal or informal group within an organisation seeking to influence its direction and activity. The term comes from the phrase ginger up, meaning to enliven or stimulate. Ginger groups work to alter the organisation's policies, practices, or office-holders, while still supporting its general goals. Ginger groups sometimes form within the political parties of Commonwealth countries https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ginger_group?wprov=sfla1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ginger_group?wprov=sfla1