6 ms·

I had a very different reading of the article. The author acknowledges that books do work after the reader actively engages with the topic, does the exercises,

by amatic 6y ago

I had a very different reading of the article. The author acknowledges that books do work after the reader actively engages with the topic, does the exercises, rereads, etc. The issue is that this process of transmitting knowledge could be more efficient in a different medium. The post is not against books, but pro interactive teaching methods, as the author gives a link to his proposal https://quantum.country/qcvc https://quantum.country/qcvc

grawprog 6y ago
I agree with this. I read the top comments before the article and went in totally expecting someone just dismissing books as useless, by the end though, I got the same takeaway as you, the author was stating the need to immerse yourself in a subject to truly learn it and that hastily reading through a single book on a subject is not something you should expect to give you full understanding of it. Not that books are useless or you shouldn't read them.
- mindcrime 6y ago
  I agree with this. I read the top comments before the article and went in totally expecting someone just dismissing books as useless, by the end though, I got the same takeaway as you, I think part of the problem is that the author of TFA sorta "buried the lede" and didn't really get to the point until very near the end. I suspect a lot of people got bored and quit reading before that point. Honestly, I did, and it wasn't until my second reading that I got what he was saying near the end, which is admittedly a somewhat different take.
- starfallg 6y ago
  Isn't the title pure clickbait then? "Books work, but they're not the complete solution" is a much better title, but then us as the audience don't need to read a multi-page Medium article type rant to know that.
  - grawprog 6y ago
    Pretty much, it's also vague and ambiguous to begin with. My first question even just seeing it was, work with what? Being HN, I figured it to be something related to programming or something rather just a general acknowledgement that 'learning takes time' To be honest, you could replace 'book' with 'video', 'article', 'podcast' or any other medium people learn from and the article could stand pretty much as is and give the same general point. The whole article could probably be more effectively re-written with the focus on time and learning, using different media as well as books as an example and make the point stronger. By choosing books as a focus, the author loses the main point and doesn't really get to it until the end, making the article, as you and other commenters pointed out, ranty and a slog to read through.
pdonis 6y ago
> The post is not against books, but pro interactive teaching methods It's both. The proposal is at the very, very end, after a boring, long-winded screed about how everything else doesn't work. > the author gives a link to his proposal I took a look. I don't see any significant difference between this and a traditional textbook.
- mcguire 6y ago
  "I took a look. I don't see any significant difference between this and a traditional textbook." I think he emails problem sets at appropriate times after you finish the book to ensure you remember everything.
  - pdonis 6y ago
    Ok, then a traditional textbook plus an instructor-led course (which could be online) that uses it--but the course would appear to have a lot more assistance available. Still not seeing how the author's proposal is anything groundbreaking.
mistermann 6y ago
Ya, me too. I'd even go further and say that critical comment itself well illustrates a different kind of dementia that Western culture (at least) increasingly exhibits: an inability to differentiate between one's perception &/or heuristic predictions, and reality. Specifically, the "premise of the article" being "I invested 15-20 hours reading this book and, boohoo, I’m not a subject matter expert on the book’s topic" is nowhere to be found in the article, at least by my reading. Or maybe it is actually there and I missed it?
dynamite-ready 6y ago
I get that side of the argument, but without being scientific about it, I suspect that alternative methods of communication will only serve to communicate a different message... Like the difference between Kubrick's 'The Shining', and Stephen King's. I suppose the author of the article would help his/her case with examples of how you can improve on what can be communicated by a book, but I reckon that might actually be impossible.

by amatic 6y ago

grawprog 6y ago

I agree with this. I read the top comments before the article and went in totally expecting someone just dismissing books as useless, by the end though, I got the same takeaway as you, the author was stating the need to immerse yourself in a subject to truly learn it and that hastily reading through a single book on a subject is not something you should expect to give you full understanding of it. Not that books are useless or you shouldn't read them.

mindcrime 6y ago
I agree with this. I read the top comments before the article and went in totally expecting someone just dismissing books as useless, by the end though, I got the same takeaway as you, I think part of the problem is that the author of TFA sorta "buried the lede" and didn't really get to the point until very near the end. I suspect a lot of people got bored and quit reading before that point. Honestly, I did, and it wasn't until my second reading that I got what he was saying near the end, which is admittedly a somewhat different take.
starfallg 6y ago
Isn't the title pure clickbait then? "Books work, but they're not the complete solution" is a much better title, but then us as the audience don't need to read a multi-page Medium article type rant to know that.
- grawprog 6y ago
  Pretty much, it's also vague and ambiguous to begin with. My first question even just seeing it was, work with what? Being HN, I figured it to be something related to programming or something rather just a general acknowledgement that 'learning takes time' To be honest, you could replace 'book' with 'video', 'article', 'podcast' or any other medium people learn from and the article could stand pretty much as is and give the same general point. The whole article could probably be more effectively re-written with the focus on time and learning, using different media as well as books as an example and make the point stronger. By choosing books as a focus, the author loses the main point and doesn't really get to it until the end, making the article, as you and other commenters pointed out, ranty and a slog to read through.

pdonis 6y ago

> The post is not against books, but pro interactive teaching methods It's both. The proposal is at the very, very end, after a boring, long-winded screed about how everything else doesn't work. > the author gives a link to his proposal I took a look. I don't see any significant difference between this and a traditional textbook.

mcguire 6y ago
"I took a look. I don't see any significant difference between this and a traditional textbook." I think he emails problem sets at appropriate times after you finish the book to ensure you remember everything.
- pdonis 6y ago
  Ok, then a traditional textbook plus an instructor-led course (which could be online) that uses it--but the course would appear to have a lot more assistance available. Still not seeing how the author's proposal is anything groundbreaking.

mistermann 6y ago

Ya, me too. I'd even go further and say that critical comment itself well illustrates a different kind of dementia that Western culture (at least) increasingly exhibits: an inability to differentiate between one's perception &/or heuristic predictions, and reality. Specifically, the "premise of the article" being "I invested 15-20 hours reading this book and, boohoo, I’m not a subject matter expert on the book’s topic" is nowhere to be found in the article, at least by my reading. Or maybe it is actually there and I missed it?

dynamite-ready 6y ago

I get that side of the argument, but without being scientific about it, I suspect that alternative methods of communication will only serve to communicate a different message... Like the difference between Kubrick's 'The Shining', and Stephen King's. I suppose the author of the article would help his/her case with examples of how you can improve on what can be communicated by a book, but I reckon that might actually be impossible.