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This is an utter farce of a trial. How any UK or US politician can stand up now, and call for sanctions against Russia or China or Iran .. beggars belief. The

This is an utter farce of a trial. How any UK or US politician can stand up now, and call for sanctions against Russia or China or Iran .. beggars belief. These are the sorts of charades we have been programmed to despise when we see it in our 'enemies' societies, when it happens - but when we are doing it, there is some moral stance that makes it acceptable. The rule of law is being eroded right before our eyes. Oh yeah. I forgot about what was done to Habeus Corpus. We are really, really fucked.

lyrr 6y ago
100% agreed. Even those among us that have for years recognised the hypocrisy of the West in condemning practises in other countries which they themselves implement, this trial of Assange is so explicit in nature that it's quite unsettling. There was an understanding that this type of thing was a line that a liberal democratic Western nation simply would not cross.
- somesortofsystm 6y ago
  Well, imho, that line seems to have been wiped away on 9/11. The USA has made so many enemies, it is now behaving like the cornered rat in a cage, i.e. just like its enemies. No government which supports this behavior, should be allowed to sit another democratic session.
  - nobody9999 6y ago
    >No government which supports this behavior, should be allowed to sit another democratic session. What are you suggesting? Should NATO invade the US and depose the "illegitemate" government? Perhaps the US military itself should stage a coup? Good luck with that.
    - somesortofsystm 6y ago
      There is a great deal of evidence to indicate the US military already did stage a coup, yo. Can't get away with genocide unless you're in control, i.e. YEMEN.
    - trasz 6y ago
      You don’t need to invade the US just to stop extraditions.
      - nobody9999 6y ago
        >You don’t need to invade the US just to stop extraditions. That's absolutely true. However the post that I responded to said nothing about extraditions. Rather, it said: >No government which supports this behavior, should be allowed to sit another democratic session. Unless I'm having serious reading comprehension problems (which I suppose is possible), OP is suggesting the dissolution of the US Government. I merely asked how they thought that should be accomplished, then wished them luck.
        somesortofsystm 6y ago
        You are having comprehensions. I was indeed referring to the nature of this article, which is Julian's heinous torture and rendition to the United States. This isn't just 'extradition', any more. The real free world, i.e. Europe, needs to stand up to this thuggery and do something about it, fast. UK is showing itself incapable of catching this real attack on free society. With this precedent set - NOBODY is safe, not even one single civilian - to openly discuss the war crimes of our war industry.
implements 6y ago
It’s not a trial, it’s a hearing to explore whether just cause exists for a US ‘arrest’, and whether the prosecution is not manifestly unreasonable. The US has excessive punishments and an overly politicised justice system by UK standards, but that’s not the what the hearing is about - legitimate jurisdiction is - and the US, as an ally, is generally trusted to prosecute people fairly under its own laws.
- somesortofsystm 6y ago
  Okay, its a hearing, not a trial - but as a 'hearing' it is still an utter farce. >as an ally, is generally trusted to prosecute people fairly under its own laws The US ranks lower than most of its allies in the international justice/rule of law rankings, in fact. Just like it does in health care and education, too. Where it ranks most of all, though, is BIG FUCKING WEAPONS STOCKPILE. So, yeah. Consider your moral authority irrelevant, comrade.
- megous 6y ago
  US is also the nation that kidnaps foreign nationals from Europe, and tortures them without any restitution or acknowledgement after it turns out the identity of the person was mistaken, and obstructs whatever international justice might have happened in such case, by threatening the esteemed judges with US financial sanctions, instead of accepting a mistake.
- AllegedAlec 6y ago
  > It’s not a trial, it’s a hearing to explore whether just cause exists for a US ‘arrest’, and whether the prosecution is not manifestly unreasonable. It sort of is. There's oodles of evidence that it does not meet the test of extradition, among others on the basis of being a political prosecution. > the US, as an ally, is generally trusted to prosecute people fairly under its own laws. No it's not.
nobody9999 6y ago
>This is an utter farce of a trial. I agree. Especially since this is an extradition hearing and not a trial. While you may not make any distinction between various types of legal proceedings, such distinctions do exist and the differences in statutes and legal precedents have significant impact on how such proceedings happen. That said, I'm not under the illusion that the Trump administration (and the Obama administration) isn't trying to make an example of Assange. But let's stick to facts rather than hyperbole. Just a crazy thought.

lyrr 6y ago

100% agreed. Even those among us that have for years recognised the hypocrisy of the West in condemning practises in other countries which they themselves implement, this trial of Assange is so explicit in nature that it's quite unsettling. There was an understanding that this type of thing was a line that a liberal democratic Western nation simply would not cross.

somesortofsystm 6y ago
Well, imho, that line seems to have been wiped away on 9/11. The USA has made so many enemies, it is now behaving like the cornered rat in a cage, i.e. just like its enemies. No government which supports this behavior, should be allowed to sit another democratic session.
- nobody9999 6y ago
  >No government which supports this behavior, should be allowed to sit another democratic session. What are you suggesting? Should NATO invade the US and depose the "illegitemate" government? Perhaps the US military itself should stage a coup? Good luck with that.
  - somesortofsystm 6y ago
    There is a great deal of evidence to indicate the US military already did stage a coup, yo. Can't get away with genocide unless you're in control, i.e. YEMEN.
  - trasz 6y ago
    You don’t need to invade the US just to stop extraditions.
    - nobody9999 6y ago
      >You don’t need to invade the US just to stop extraditions. That's absolutely true. However the post that I responded to said nothing about extraditions. Rather, it said: >No government which supports this behavior, should be allowed to sit another democratic session. Unless I'm having serious reading comprehension problems (which I suppose is possible), OP is suggesting the dissolution of the US Government. I merely asked how they thought that should be accomplished, then wished them luck.
      - somesortofsystm 6y ago
        You are having comprehensions. I was indeed referring to the nature of this article, which is Julian's heinous torture and rendition to the United States. This isn't just 'extradition', any more. The real free world, i.e. Europe, needs to stand up to this thuggery and do something about it, fast. UK is showing itself incapable of catching this real attack on free society. With this precedent set - NOBODY is safe, not even one single civilian - to openly discuss the war crimes of our war industry.

implements 6y ago

It’s not a trial, it’s a hearing to explore whether just cause exists for a US ‘arrest’, and whether the prosecution is not manifestly unreasonable. The US has excessive punishments and an overly politicised justice system by UK standards, but that’s not the what the hearing is about - legitimate jurisdiction is - and the US, as an ally, is generally trusted to prosecute people fairly under its own laws.

somesortofsystm 6y ago
Okay, its a hearing, not a trial - but as a 'hearing' it is still an utter farce. >as an ally, is generally trusted to prosecute people fairly under its own laws The US ranks lower than most of its allies in the international justice/rule of law rankings, in fact. Just like it does in health care and education, too. Where it ranks most of all, though, is BIG FUCKING WEAPONS STOCKPILE. So, yeah. Consider your moral authority irrelevant, comrade.
megous 6y ago
US is also the nation that kidnaps foreign nationals from Europe, and tortures them without any restitution or acknowledgement after it turns out the identity of the person was mistaken, and obstructs whatever international justice might have happened in such case, by threatening the esteemed judges with US financial sanctions, instead of accepting a mistake.
AllegedAlec 6y ago
> It’s not a trial, it’s a hearing to explore whether just cause exists for a US ‘arrest’, and whether the prosecution is not manifestly unreasonable. It sort of is. There's oodles of evidence that it does not meet the test of extradition, among others on the basis of being a political prosecution. > the US, as an ally, is generally trusted to prosecute people fairly under its own laws. No it's not.

nobody9999 6y ago

>This is an utter farce of a trial. I agree. Especially since this is an extradition hearing and not a trial. While you may not make any distinction between various types of legal proceedings, such distinctions do exist and the differences in statutes and legal precedents have significant impact on how such proceedings happen. That said, I'm not under the illusion that the Trump administration (and the Obama administration) isn't trying to make an example of Assange. But let's stick to facts rather than hyperbole. Just a crazy thought.