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> The more we automate the creation of food, water, clothing, and shelter, the fewer people we need to keep the rest of us from starving or freezing to death. W

> The more we automate the creation of food, water, clothing, and shelter, the fewer people we need to keep the rest of us from starving or freezing to death. What do the rest of us do for a living? Why do we keep going? Why would the few remaining workers elect to work only to provide for others?

deleted 6y ago
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hinkley 6y ago
Right, so the first order problem is, “my self worth is in doubt.” And the second order problem is, “why am I busting my hump for these worthless do-nothings?” Even if you manage not to sink into an existential pit of despair, some rabble rouser may incite the means of production to rebel against you, introducing an external existential threat. So the dignity you’re looking for may save your life, twice. How do we do that, outside of intentional work slowdowns or Futurama suicide booths? Ever escalating consumption is the answer since WWII, but we are killing ourselves doing that. What else is there? You can start by doing all the things we never find the time to do. I don’t know how we solve that problem for the great grandkids, though. Probably involves space colonies. Mars would be a ridiculously massive jobs creation program.
- fogihujy 6y ago
  Definitely. Selling dreams about a better life and tickets to some colony has proved to be a reliable way of handling it. Time will tell.
- vagrantJin 6y ago
  Mars would create meaning in peoples work. Not just work for its own sake. The long shitty hours and crappy conditions could be justified as a man who is building his family's house with his own hands.
  - dragonwriter 6y ago
    Sure, a frontier is an (extremely temporary, usually) relief from the alienation of capitalism for those on it. OTOH, if the alienation of capitalism is really the problems you want to address, Mars is an extremely expensive way to solve it, even temporarily, for a very small slice of the people who are afflicted by it.

deleted 6y ago

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hinkley 6y ago

Right, so the first order problem is, “my self worth is in doubt.” And the second order problem is, “why am I busting my hump for these worthless do-nothings?” Even if you manage not to sink into an existential pit of despair, some rabble rouser may incite the means of production to rebel against you, introducing an external existential threat. So the dignity you’re looking for may save your life, twice. How do we do that, outside of intentional work slowdowns or Futurama suicide booths? Ever escalating consumption is the answer since WWII, but we are killing ourselves doing that. What else is there? You can start by doing all the things we never find the time to do. I don’t know how we solve that problem for the great grandkids, though. Probably involves space colonies. Mars would be a ridiculously massive jobs creation program.

fogihujy 6y ago
Definitely. Selling dreams about a better life and tickets to some colony has proved to be a reliable way of handling it. Time will tell.
vagrantJin 6y ago
Mars would create meaning in peoples work. Not just work for its own sake. The long shitty hours and crappy conditions could be justified as a man who is building his family's house with his own hands.
- dragonwriter 6y ago
  Sure, a frontier is an (extremely temporary, usually) relief from the alienation of capitalism for those on it. OTOH, if the alienation of capitalism is really the problems you want to address, Mars is an extremely expensive way to solve it, even temporarily, for a very small slice of the people who are afflicted by it.