7 ms·
> Remarkably, we found that the shape of the electric waves recorded in a non-acoustic area of the brain when linguistic expressions are being read silently pre
by guram11 6y ago
> Remarkably, we found that the shape of the electric waves recorded in a non-acoustic area of the brain when linguistic expressions are being read silently preserves the same structure as those of the mechanical sound waves of air that would have been produced if those words had actually been uttered
the Rosetta stone idea to map thought from languages waves (sound and light) is an interesting field of research
I have no idea how but since I was young I learned that I can read faster when I don't "voice" out the sound of thought
I also learned that as a multilingual person the "language" of choice for my thought can be different at times, even though I have no actual fondness of using any specifically
- 082349872349872 6y agoThe obvious follow up experiment is to have the subjects read silently first, then read aloud. (I've also found I can readily manipulate algebraic symbols without having any idea of how they should be pronounced. splodge?) https://i.pinimg.com/originals/67/bc/35/67bc35746db0758b5ab4e764a05ced04.jpg https://i.pinimg.com/originals/67/bc/35/67bc35746db0758b5ab4...
- TeMPOraL 6y agoFor me, some words and phrases sound better in one language than the other. So in my internal monologue, I often flip back and forth between Polish and English, sometimes multiple times in a single sentence. It feels like "the path of least resistance". I also do that sometimes when talking, when I know the other person is proficient in English. Not everyone appreciates this, but some of the best conversations in my life were with a particular person who was like me in this regard; we'd just stream our thoughts to each other in this weird mix of Polish and English, that was hard to follow for anyone else.
- sebmellen 6y agoI know the same feeling with English and German. It really is a wonderful thing. I think this would be called Code-switching [0]. > In linguistics, code-switching or language alternation occurs when a speaker alternates between two or more languages, or language varieties, in the context of a single conversation. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code-switching https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code-switching
- 082349872349872 6y agoWechseln even dans a fraza: http://www.europanto.be/cabillot1.html http://www.europanto.be/cabillot1.html
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- spurgu 6y agoHaha. Minä gör the same a menudo. Yo teen det samma often. I hago the same ofta. Jag do lo mismo usein. (FI/SV/EN/ES) :)
- 082349872349872 6y agoWow, closest I can get to that mix is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6VqUiSdd3yM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6VqUiSdd3yM , an english band interpreting a finnish tango. Swedish will have to be separate: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hdUKZLQIuQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hdUKZLQIuQ (Are you a finland-swede or sweden finn? If either of those, I'm a fan of both Army of Lovers and Nightwish.)
- spurgu 6y agoHaha yes that Zappa gig is a classic! "Swedish-speaking finn" or "Finland-swede" yes.
- dontcarethrow2 6y agoBelta loda! You sound like your speaking the Belter slang from the scifi series The Expanse. Set a few hundred yrs into the future, slang used by the working class out mining the asteroid belts.
- 082349872349872 6y agoTaki taki. TIL. Tolowda wanya pochuye fo walowda sowngit ke? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ULICEPpoLQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ULICEPpoLQ
- notdang 6y agoNow try to imagine instead of English, it's Russian? Switching from Polish to Russian. Will it be the same?
- 082349872349872 6y agoPolish/ukrainian song lyrics: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cxciyZEBkE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cxciyZEBkE (switching between stanzas, not phrases, however) Amateur joint translation here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24101696 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24101696 (any native speakers care to say how close we came?) (and notdang, on the off chance you're from somewhere around Moldova, what would you say the ethnicity of the girl in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24406864 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24406864 might be? I think a woman from Moldova is the normal reading, but apparently there's also an Odessa neighbourhood called Moldavanka...)
- TeMPOraL 6y agoI know a little bit of Russian so a random word or two sometimes sneak into my speech or thinking process. I imagine if I were fluent in Russian, I'd switch back and forth just as well. They're more similar to each other than Polish and English, but not that similar as to be bucketed as one language. I've been thinking about this phenomenon a lot in the past and I've noticed that two main triggers are a) emotional payload of a phrase, and b) subtle differences in meaning of words. Some phrases sound better to me in English than in Polish, and it's probably driven by the context in which I've learned them. As for words, it's often the case that even if a word in Polish corresponds directly to a word in English by dictionary, their etymologies and general use patterns draw slightly different borders in thingspace. Sometimes that distinction is important, and I automatically pick the language in which the word is closer to what I mean.
- notdang 6y agoNot sure what are the sentiments in Poland, but in a couple of ex-USSR countries mixing Russian and the local language is regarded as a very bad taste. This applies exclusively to Russian.
- fsflover 6y ago> I have no idea how but since I was young I learned that I can read faster when I don't "voice" out the sound of thought https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_reading https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_reading
- lethologica 6y ago>I have no idea how but since I was young I learned that I can read faster when I don't "voice" out the sound of thought Subvocalisation is the term for that voice in your head when you read. I've never been able to get rid of it, and trying to has always resulted in me feeling like I'm skimming rather than reading.
- mellavora 6y agoyes, that is the secret. "reading" is not one activity, there are 100s of ways to read.
- dontcarethrow2 6y agoI think a way to practice it would be through math exercises. You don't really voice out '3 + 8' as much as 'three plus eight'. Also thinking further I think books directed at children would probably also help, I feel like complex terms keep me subvocalising when reading.
- kace91 6y agoI wonder if the same is true for languages where the writing system is not a representation of sounds, like written chinese.
- tsimionescu 6y agoMy understanding was that written Chinese has a great deal of phonetic information (even though it is not exclusively phonetic like the alphabet or Japanese Hiragana/Katakana). I had understood that many ideograms essentially could be interpreted as topic + pronunciation: e.g. 驰 could be interpreted as "the word about 马 horses read as 也 chí".
- filoeleven 6y agoAt least one of the Chinese languages is tonal too, so the same sequence of vowel and consonant sounds can have totally different meanings when spoken at different pitches. (The humorous example is “grass mud horse,” which is a bit NSFW and a great act of someone thumbing their nose at censorship.) I wonder if native speakers have a greater emphasis on subvocalized pitch, or if that’s even a part of subvocalizing? Paying attention to my own internal reading now, I suspect that it is.
- r16w 6y agoEnglish is my first language, but I find that when I read in Mandarin, I can focus on intonations, personality, etc or leave it out as sort of monotone. The intonations that give the characters their meaning are so engrained in the flow of the sentences it can feel monotone, as it is just the way it is said. If I am reading a poem or idioms I usually like to over emphasize the tone like a classic theatrical reading because it’s fun and helps me remember what I read.