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Chinese-owned companies have no right to withhold data from the state. China National Intelligence Law Article 7: Any organization or citizen shall support, a

Chinese-owned companies have no right to withhold data from the state. China National Intelligence Law Article 7: Any organization or citizen shall support, assist and cooperate with the state intelligence work in accordance with the law, and keep the secrets of the national intelligence work known to the public. The State protects individuals and organizations that support, assist and cooperate with national intelligence work https://cs.brown.edu/courses/csci1800/sources/2017_PRC_NationalIntelligenceLaw.pdf https://cs.brown.edu/courses/csci1800/sources/2017_PRC_Natio...

xvector 6y ago
I’m amazed you could say this without mentioning that US companies, too, have no right to withhold data from the state. We have irrefutable gag orders which force compliance with the NSA [1]. FISA warrants are a joke, a rubber stamp at best. Only every 12 in about 33,000 are denied [2]. [1]: https://www.eff.org/issues/national-security-letters https://www.eff.org/issues/national-security-letters [2]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Foreign_Intelligence_Surveillance_Court#FISA_warrants https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Foreign_Intell...
- mortdeus 6y ago
  I did mention it by saying I don't believe any government should be able to access user data without oversight. However with that being said, I'm not totally against the idea of the NSA having the power to conduct surveillance to the degree at which it does. It's one of those things where I am not happy about it, but then again I'm not so pissed off that im going to lead the charge that somebody deserves to be thrown overboard because of it.
- tatrajim 6y ago
  Two crucial differences: 1) Chinese law can be used to coerce indivudusls (including presumably tech company execs) to spy for the state. That is illegal under US law. And uf you're a Chinese student abroad, good luck saying no to the Public Security tity Office when asked to spy on other students. 2) US law, however evilly applied, requires a modicum of specificity and a fig leaf of justification. China law has no such need and can appropriate at scale to its bureaucratic desire (e.g, all IP addresses in Washington, D.C.)
ineedasername 6y ago
I'm aware of this. I think the proper way to deal with this is with our own laws regarding data usage. Not with ad-hoc policy made for a single case. The issue is bigger than TikTok and handling it in this way not only makes it into a significant issue of geo-political maneuvering and economic policy, it doesn't actually solve the fundamental problem. If we don't want consumer corporations owned through other countries sharing our data with their government's intelligence agencies, we need laws, not a shoot-from-the-hip approach that deals only with the high-profile panic of the moment example. We're a "rule of law" nation. Absent extreme circumstances it should be laws that deal with actions we decide are improper. Otherwise we're no longer a nation of laws, we're a nation with a series of individuals who seek to enforce their will rather than the law.

xvector 6y ago

I’m amazed you could say this without mentioning that US companies, too, have no right to withhold data from the state. We have irrefutable gag orders which force compliance with the NSA [1]. FISA warrants are a joke, a rubber stamp at best. Only every 12 in about 33,000 are denied [2]. [1]: https://www.eff.org/issues/national-security-letters https://www.eff.org/issues/national-security-letters [2]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Foreign_Intelligence_Surveillance_Court#FISA_warrants https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Foreign_Intell...

mortdeus 6y ago
I did mention it by saying I don't believe any government should be able to access user data without oversight. However with that being said, I'm not totally against the idea of the NSA having the power to conduct surveillance to the degree at which it does. It's one of those things where I am not happy about it, but then again I'm not so pissed off that im going to lead the charge that somebody deserves to be thrown overboard because of it.
tatrajim 6y ago
Two crucial differences: 1) Chinese law can be used to coerce indivudusls (including presumably tech company execs) to spy for the state. That is illegal under US law. And uf you're a Chinese student abroad, good luck saying no to the Public Security tity Office when asked to spy on other students. 2) US law, however evilly applied, requires a modicum of specificity and a fig leaf of justification. China law has no such need and can appropriate at scale to its bureaucratic desire (e.g, all IP addresses in Washington, D.C.)

ineedasername 6y ago

I'm aware of this. I think the proper way to deal with this is with our own laws regarding data usage. Not with ad-hoc policy made for a single case. The issue is bigger than TikTok and handling it in this way not only makes it into a significant issue of geo-political maneuvering and economic policy, it doesn't actually solve the fundamental problem. If we don't want consumer corporations owned through other countries sharing our data with their government's intelligence agencies, we need laws, not a shoot-from-the-hip approach that deals only with the high-profile panic of the moment example. We're a "rule of law" nation. Absent extreme circumstances it should be laws that deal with actions we decide are improper. Otherwise we're no longer a nation of laws, we're a nation with a series of individuals who seek to enforce their will rather than the law.