4 ms·

Also, "the government will take strict measures to blacklist visitors who damage national parks or are noisy and disruptive." I fully support this policy, and

Also, "the government will take strict measures to blacklist visitors who damage national parks or are noisy and disruptive." I fully support this policy, and I hope it gets implemented in more parks around the world.

npongratz 6y ago
Do those "strict measures" include a full and fair trial, to allow the accused to defend themselves, to confront their accuser, and examine the available evidence that was gathered against the accused? Is there a jury of one's peers involved? A dispassionate judge of high integrity overseeing and perhaps rendering judgment? If any of those things are missing, it seems like it would be easy and cheap to disenfranchise any person, regardless of actual guilt. For what it's worth, I very much despise anyone who litters or damages parks, and hope they are caught and punished properly.
- ido 6y ago
  The jury is mostly an American thing, most other countries don't have that - the judge decides who is guilty.
  - Symbiote 6y ago
    Juries are an English thing, from the 12th Century. Countries whose legal systems developed from England's are likely to have inherited them.
    - ido 6y ago
      I stand corrected! either way they are not universal
    - kwhitefoot 6y ago
      We had juries here in Norway too until 2017. I'm moderately sure that Norway did not inherit the idea from England. Also Denmark had them until recently and Belgium and Austria still have them. So it is not just an English thing.
      - conception 6y ago
        They did - https://www.britannica.com/topic/jury https://www.britannica.com/topic/jury https://www.britannica.com/topic/Scandinavian-law#ref469034 https://www.britannica.com/topic/Scandinavian-law#ref469034 Well.. they got it from Germany and France who got it from England.
        kwhitefoot 6y ago
        Interesting, thanks.
- pkaye 6y ago
  No jury system in Thailand. https://travel.gc.ca/travelling/advisories/overview-of-the-criminal-law-system-in-thailand https://travel.gc.ca/travelling/advisories/overview-of-the-c...
kwhitefoot 6y ago
Sounds like an opportunity for a denial of service attack via business card.

npongratz 6y ago

Do those "strict measures" include a full and fair trial, to allow the accused to defend themselves, to confront their accuser, and examine the available evidence that was gathered against the accused? Is there a jury of one's peers involved? A dispassionate judge of high integrity overseeing and perhaps rendering judgment? If any of those things are missing, it seems like it would be easy and cheap to disenfranchise any person, regardless of actual guilt. For what it's worth, I very much despise anyone who litters or damages parks, and hope they are caught and punished properly.

ido 6y ago
The jury is mostly an American thing, most other countries don't have that - the judge decides who is guilty.
- Symbiote 6y ago
  Juries are an English thing, from the 12th Century. Countries whose legal systems developed from England's are likely to have inherited them.
  - ido 6y ago
    I stand corrected! either way they are not universal
  - kwhitefoot 6y ago
    We had juries here in Norway too until 2017. I'm moderately sure that Norway did not inherit the idea from England. Also Denmark had them until recently and Belgium and Austria still have them. So it is not just an English thing.
    - conception 6y ago
      They did - https://www.britannica.com/topic/jury https://www.britannica.com/topic/jury https://www.britannica.com/topic/Scandinavian-law#ref469034 https://www.britannica.com/topic/Scandinavian-law#ref469034 Well.. they got it from Germany and France who got it from England.
      - kwhitefoot 6y ago
        Interesting, thanks.
pkaye 6y ago
No jury system in Thailand. https://travel.gc.ca/travelling/advisories/overview-of-the-criminal-law-system-in-thailand https://travel.gc.ca/travelling/advisories/overview-of-the-c...

kwhitefoot 6y ago

Sounds like an opportunity for a denial of service attack via business card.