7 ms·
there are zero people who fit this description
by evan_ 6y ago
there are zero people who fit this description
- int_19h 6y agoA lot of right libertarians are in this boat, actually.
- evan_ 6y agoWhy? Trump is never going to appoint a justice who will legitimately advance any cause of liberty. He’s going to appoint someone who will protect his power and the power of the Republican Party. Trump making more appointments is exactly the same as him getting another 4 years, except it will last decades.
- rayiner 6y agoGorsuch is the most libertarian-leaning Justice we’ve had in decades. Others on the short list, such as Barrett or Kethledge, also have significant records of originalism with respect to the scope of the administrative state. I don’t think libertarians realize where we are in 2020. Lots of culture war stuff from the last few decades where libertarians sided with liberals (abortion, contraception, same-sex marriage) has now flipped and then battleground is keeping the government from forcing people to participate in those things: Catholics being forced to perform elective abortions, nuns being forced to pay for contraception, people being forced to participate in same-sex weddings as bakers (and presumably caterers, etc.)
- evan_ 6y ago> Catholics being forced to perform elective abortions, nuns being forced to pay for contraception, people being forced to participate in same-sex weddings as bakers so the solution is to ban abortions, contraceptives, and same-sex marriage altogether?
- rayiner 6y agoIn almost 50 years of a conservative Supreme Court majority, what major liberal precedent has been overturned? Basically none. Heck, Roe itself was a 7-2 decision with two Nixon appointees in the majority. Roberts won’t vote to overturn Roe, neither will Gorsuch, and probably neither will Kavanaugh. Kavanaugh, a Kennedy disciple, won’t undo Obergefell, probably neither will Gorsuch. History shows that conservative justice at best hold the line on social issues, or continue to move forward. Look at the political debates likely to come up over the next 10 years and tell me where libertarians are aligned with liberals. Apart from the things I mentioned above, cases that will come up may include the constitutionality of a wealth tax, changes to equal protection to allow discrimination in favor of particular groups, firearms confiscation, etc. (I’m not saying all of these will happen, I’m pointing out what the next legal battlegrounds will be.)
- throwaway6274 6y ago> conservative justice at best hold the line on social issues, or continue to move forward. The difference is that—unlike racial justice, women's rights, and gay rights—in this case abortion was a mistake and so the step forward would be to reverse it. If you go back far enough, society has successfully reversed actions that were at the time considered forward progress.
- jkhdigital 6y agoDude you are really going to town on this posting. Kudos for fighting the good fight, I'm trying to balance out the downvotes but I'm clearly outnumbered lol. I always feel dirty AF after these flamewars so I don't know how you can do it. Also, I think most of the "right libertarians" are already Trump votes out of sheer disgust and exasperation. Libertarians (of any stripe) are probably the least likely to get hot and bothered by Trump's antics.
- projektfu 6y agoAre you referring to the following story, where the US government is suing a hospital for not respecting the religious morality of a nurse? https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-49515372 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-49515372
- rayiner 6y agoYes, among other things: https://www.wsj.com/articles/federal-judge-strikes-down-rule-on-conscience-provisions-for-medical-providers-11573064086 https://www.wsj.com/articles/federal-judge-strikes-down-rule.... Opposition to conscience rights--forcing medical providers to provide contraception or abortions in non-emergency situations when it is against their religious beliefs--is the next policy front for certain organizations: https://www.prochoiceamerica.org/issue/abortion-refusal-laws https://www.prochoiceamerica.org/issue/abortion-refusal-laws. Nearly all EU countries recognize such conscience rights. Eliminating them would put the U.S. squarely outside the mainstream on this issue: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscientious_objection_to_abortion#United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscientious_objection_to_abo... ("Conscientious objection is granted in 22 member states of the European Union plus the United Kingdom, Norway and Switzerland.").
- projektfu 6y agoSo the libertarian position is now that conscience cannot be protected by contract law between consenting parties?
- rayiner 6y agoThe context of this is laws that would require providers to provide certain services, under which such a contract would be deemed illegally opting out (as set forth in the court case linked above). That’s the whole point of this effort.
- projektfu 6y agoIs there a law in the US that forces a doctor to perform an abortion or a nurse to participate? Aside from one that says that your employer can ask you to fulfill the terms of your contract or lose your job? It seems that the vast majority of laws limiting physician freedom are being proposed or passed to prevent them from performing abortions, counseling patients about abortion, or discuss guns in the household.
- int_19h 6y agoI'm not a right libertarian, so I can't really argue with you. But you have to understand that your perspective on Trump is not necessarily shared by them, regardless of how objective it may be.