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Why does the rest of the world tolerate American bullying is beyond me. At least in Europe, we should ban every Facebook app immediately. This would have the ad

by bambax 6y ago

Why does the rest of the world tolerate American bullying is beyond me. At least in Europe, we should ban every Facebook app immediately. This would have the added benefit of letting regional apps emerge.

jlmorton 6y ago
One big reason is that America controls the SWIFT network for settling international transactions. If you hate American commercial bullying, perhaps the biggest thing to be excited about is Europe's SWIFT-alternative, INSTEX. The world is so reliant on SWIFT currently that America can grind your commerce to a halt if you don't refuse to do business with entities it doesn't want you to. (I realize this current TikTok action is domestic-only and unrelated to SWIFT, but I'm speaking more broadly).
- tobias3 6y ago
  "SWIFT" is already in Belgium and INSTEX isn't a SWIFT replacement. This isn't a technical problem (one can transfer money other ways as well, for example). If an entity does business with Iran it risks being put on the US Entity List (think Huawei) or other sanctions. US influence currently is still far reaching and many businesses don't want to risk (future) complications for little gain (Iran isn't that large of an economy). The calculus changes if it is a market as large as China, though.
pantalaimon 6y ago
Germany just offered to invest $1.2 billion in LNG terminals if US allows them to continue with Nordstream 2. https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/Germany-Offered-US-12B-To-Save-Nord-Stream-2.html https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/Germany-O...
- Aperocky 6y ago
  Thanks for the link, that's an interesting read. The media is trying its darnedest to paint China as the biggest bully, except it doesn't even compare to US in real world.
  - irwt 6y ago
    So we’re ignoring the fact that Germany basically backstabbed Ukraine with that deal on purpose? Germany did not want to get involved into the Russia / Ukraine conflict because of Russia’s gas dependence, but they knew that Ukraine could force them to take a stance because of their pipeline. So Germany screwed them over and started a pipeline directly with Russia. Germany here is just as much of a scumbag as the US.
  - ergocoder 6y ago
    Really? South China Sea? Tibet? Or even an island dispute with Japan? It's way worse than any worst business deal.
kinkrtyavimoodh 6y ago
In international diplomacy these days you either have to tolerate bullying or be the bully yourself, and often both. For instance, the EU bullies American tech companies through 'litigation'.
gurkendoktor 6y ago
China bans half the internet, the US bans two Chinese apps, therefore the EU should retaliate against the US? I am all for fighting back against the influence of Facebook in Europe (especially WhatsApp), but I don't see why we should care about this case at all. Most US "bullying" that we experience in the EU is just Silicon Valley absorbing our top IT talent (after _our_ tax payers have bankrolled everyone's university education in full). There's no need for actual bullying because we don't even have any killer apps, much less our own hardware or operating systems that the US could possibly ban.
ergocoder 6y ago
Because you haven't seen what China has done with territory disputes. South China sea, Taiwan, Vietnam, Phillipines, Tibet, India, Japan. China literally builds a fake island to claim the territory. China doesn't aim to trade with us. They just want to take the land. When US wants to install an army in these countries, they at least make a business deal that has expiry date. --- Europe and US are in a very strong relationship. They can work out whatever dispute they have. Europe and US generally want a win-win situation with each other. Can we say the same about China? Nope.

by bambax 6y ago

jlmorton 6y ago

One big reason is that America controls the SWIFT network for settling international transactions. If you hate American commercial bullying, perhaps the biggest thing to be excited about is Europe's SWIFT-alternative, INSTEX. The world is so reliant on SWIFT currently that America can grind your commerce to a halt if you don't refuse to do business with entities it doesn't want you to. (I realize this current TikTok action is domestic-only and unrelated to SWIFT, but I'm speaking more broadly).

tobias3 6y ago
"SWIFT" is already in Belgium and INSTEX isn't a SWIFT replacement. This isn't a technical problem (one can transfer money other ways as well, for example). If an entity does business with Iran it risks being put on the US Entity List (think Huawei) or other sanctions. US influence currently is still far reaching and many businesses don't want to risk (future) complications for little gain (Iran isn't that large of an economy). The calculus changes if it is a market as large as China, though.

pantalaimon 6y ago

Germany just offered to invest $1.2 billion in LNG terminals if US allows them to continue with Nordstream 2. https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/Germany-Offered-US-12B-To-Save-Nord-Stream-2.html https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/Germany-O...

Aperocky 6y ago
Thanks for the link, that's an interesting read. The media is trying its darnedest to paint China as the biggest bully, except it doesn't even compare to US in real world.
- irwt 6y ago
  So we’re ignoring the fact that Germany basically backstabbed Ukraine with that deal on purpose? Germany did not want to get involved into the Russia / Ukraine conflict because of Russia’s gas dependence, but they knew that Ukraine could force them to take a stance because of their pipeline. So Germany screwed them over and started a pipeline directly with Russia. Germany here is just as much of a scumbag as the US.
- ergocoder 6y ago
  Really? South China Sea? Tibet? Or even an island dispute with Japan? It's way worse than any worst business deal.

kinkrtyavimoodh 6y ago

In international diplomacy these days you either have to tolerate bullying or be the bully yourself, and often both. For instance, the EU bullies American tech companies through 'litigation'.

gurkendoktor 6y ago

China bans half the internet, the US bans two Chinese apps, therefore the EU should retaliate against the US? I am all for fighting back against the influence of Facebook in Europe (especially WhatsApp), but I don't see why we should care about this case at all. Most US "bullying" that we experience in the EU is just Silicon Valley absorbing our top IT talent (after _our_ tax payers have bankrolled everyone's university education in full). There's no need for actual bullying because we don't even have any killer apps, much less our own hardware or operating systems that the US could possibly ban.

ergocoder 6y ago

Because you haven't seen what China has done with territory disputes. South China sea, Taiwan, Vietnam, Phillipines, Tibet, India, Japan. China literally builds a fake island to claim the territory. China doesn't aim to trade with us. They just want to take the land. When US wants to install an army in these countries, they at least make a business deal that has expiry date. --- Europe and US are in a very strong relationship. They can work out whatever dispute they have. Europe and US generally want a win-win situation with each other. Can we say the same about China? Nope.