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by thesausageking 6y ago

[redacted]

agumonkey 6y ago
Who ? Thiel ?
- thesausageking 6y ago
  [redacted]
  - eloff 6y ago
    That's a long way from your claim that Trump was elected in large part due to Thiel.
ericmay 6y ago
Yea but if the citizens of the US don't like it they can call on their representatives to introduce a bill limiting that power or whatnot. The president also theoretically has the power to just unilaterally start a war or even drop a nuclear bomb on another country. But this isn't a Trump issue, we've increasingly turned to look at the president as the government instead of elected representatives. In an ideal scenario, you'd know who your state senators are, and your district representative, and when it comes to matters of federal government you go straight to them and then they vote on your behalf. This of course means even more importantly you should know your state representatives, mayor, etc. and be active in the politics of your own community. But instead we're lazy so we just want the president to be a dictator instead of safeguarding our republic.
- mcgt 6y ago
  >But instead we're lazy so we just want the president to be a dictator instead of safeguarding our republic. Funny. I wrote my senator months ago about that encryption bill going around then. Just got a canned response back today, about how law enforcement should be able to access encrypted nformation, etc. Poetically waxing about the effects of "writing your reps" is bullshit when they are entrenched with one another and, as you said, most Americans don't care enough to do it. Maybe a better solution would be for the US to balkanize and allow localization to be more effective. Maybe a national identity more akin to the diverse regions of the US would be more like what you're describing.
  - ericmay 6y ago
    > Funny. I wrote my senator months ago about that encryption bill going around then. Just got a canned response back today, about how law enforcement should be able to access encrypted information, etc. So give up then? Idk what you want me to tell you. I'd rather people just not even complain about anything if they're so disillusioned with the government that they think they are powerless, why even care about any problems at all? > Maybe a better solution would be for the US to balkanize and allow localization to be more effective. Maybe a national identity more akin to the diverse regions of the US would be more like what you're describing. I don't disagree, actually. Local government governs best. You'll see largely the most successful governments are have smaller populations, often times more homogenous (not necessarily race, but more so culture), and I'm not sure if it's a factor but I believe population density plays a role.
  - jmeister 6y ago
    Reg. balkanisation: there are already successful examples of Belgium and Canada. I think the reason it’s never discussed is that it can easily snowball into full fledged secession.
  - frenchy 6y ago
    Not American, but we have a similar situation here, just with less political extremism. I think a part of this is that many of the issues that are important to techies are either unimportant to most voters, or the voters don't understand them enough for form a good opinion. When an representative is representing hundreds of thousands of people, it's not really surprising that they ignore feedback on issues that most people don't care about. Balkanization might help, but many states have been doing the exact opposite of that for the last 200 years because there's a lot of benefit to having a common set of laws and unregulated trade & travel over a large region.
- jmoss20 6y ago
  > The president also theoretically has the power to just unilaterally start a war... ? "The Congress shall have Power . . . To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules conquering Captures on Land and Water;" -- US Constitution, Article I, 8.11
  - detaro 6y ago
    Maybe the argument is that you don't need to declare a war to start one?
  - samatman 6y ago
    Please don't be naive. The workaround, for at least fifty years, has simply been for the President to start a war without going through the formality of declaring one. Congress could probably put a stop to it after the fact. We don't know this for sure, because thus far they just rubber-stamp it. Military-industrial money flows into everyone's district, by design.
justapassenger 6y ago
> President who was elected in a large part because of a Facebook board member. This is super naive thinking that ignores real huge issues in USA around inequality.
- akhilcacharya 6y ago
  Inequality? What exactly do you mean?
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
newen 6y ago
Trump wasn't elected because of magic mind hacking by Facebook or whatever. He appealed to issues that people were concerned about, whatever you may think of those issues, and so they voted for him.
- kevin_thibedeau 6y ago
  Watch the latest Triumph bit from the Colbert show to see the mentality of Trump supporters. We are living in an idiocracy now. 51% of Americans have no critical thinking skills. The "issues" are whatever you can use to trigger an emotional response from someone who is easily manipulated.
  - Alupis 6y ago
    > Watch the latest Triumph bit from the Colbert show to see the mentality of Trump supporters Colbert has built a career upon exaggerating and editorializing politics. He is an entertainer and comedian, not an analyst. He is hardly a sound source for any real political insight. > The "issues" are whatever you can use to trigger an emotional response from someone who is easily manipulated. I think the same can be said about both political ideologies in the US. Emotional issues are far easier to get worked up about, even if there is no easy solution to the "issue" at hand. To claim only 51% of the country falls into this category, and to imply it's only one political ideology, is disingenuous at best. Particularly when you lead your post with something a comedian said on a late night TV show, ie. the very same emotional appeal you rail against.
    - jessaustin 6y ago
      I think the same can be said about both political ideologies in the US. Definitely. So much this, that I wonder if "both" is even the right word? So much sound and fury, and somehow Congress votes nearly unanimously to give rich people trillions in response to a pandemic, while doing nothing about health care. Somehow we're spending $750B on the military every year, more than the next fifteen nations combined, with our increase this year dwarfing Russia's total spending. Somehow in the coming election we have a confused loudmouth old man from the urban northeast who likes draft deferments, non-consensual digital penetration, and criminal-panic race baiting, running against Trump.

[redacted]

agumonkey 6y ago

Who ? Thiel ?

thesausageking 6y ago
[redacted]
- eloff 6y ago
  That's a long way from your claim that Trump was elected in large part due to Thiel.

ericmay 6y ago

Yea but if the citizens of the US don't like it they can call on their representatives to introduce a bill limiting that power or whatnot. The president also theoretically has the power to just unilaterally start a war or even drop a nuclear bomb on another country. But this isn't a Trump issue, we've increasingly turned to look at the president as the government instead of elected representatives. In an ideal scenario, you'd know who your state senators are, and your district representative, and when it comes to matters of federal government you go straight to them and then they vote on your behalf. This of course means even more importantly you should know your state representatives, mayor, etc. and be active in the politics of your own community. But instead we're lazy so we just want the president to be a dictator instead of safeguarding our republic.

mcgt 6y ago
>But instead we're lazy so we just want the president to be a dictator instead of safeguarding our republic. Funny. I wrote my senator months ago about that encryption bill going around then. Just got a canned response back today, about how law enforcement should be able to access encrypted nformation, etc. Poetically waxing about the effects of "writing your reps" is bullshit when they are entrenched with one another and, as you said, most Americans don't care enough to do it. Maybe a better solution would be for the US to balkanize and allow localization to be more effective. Maybe a national identity more akin to the diverse regions of the US would be more like what you're describing.
- ericmay 6y ago
  > Funny. I wrote my senator months ago about that encryption bill going around then. Just got a canned response back today, about how law enforcement should be able to access encrypted information, etc. So give up then? Idk what you want me to tell you. I'd rather people just not even complain about anything if they're so disillusioned with the government that they think they are powerless, why even care about any problems at all? > Maybe a better solution would be for the US to balkanize and allow localization to be more effective. Maybe a national identity more akin to the diverse regions of the US would be more like what you're describing. I don't disagree, actually. Local government governs best. You'll see largely the most successful governments are have smaller populations, often times more homogenous (not necessarily race, but more so culture), and I'm not sure if it's a factor but I believe population density plays a role.
- jmeister 6y ago
  Reg. balkanisation: there are already successful examples of Belgium and Canada. I think the reason it’s never discussed is that it can easily snowball into full fledged secession.
- frenchy 6y ago
  Not American, but we have a similar situation here, just with less political extremism. I think a part of this is that many of the issues that are important to techies are either unimportant to most voters, or the voters don't understand them enough for form a good opinion. When an representative is representing hundreds of thousands of people, it's not really surprising that they ignore feedback on issues that most people don't care about. Balkanization might help, but many states have been doing the exact opposite of that for the last 200 years because there's a lot of benefit to having a common set of laws and unregulated trade & travel over a large region.
jmoss20 6y ago
> The president also theoretically has the power to just unilaterally start a war... ? "The Congress shall have Power . . . To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules conquering Captures on Land and Water;" -- US Constitution, Article I, 8.11
- detaro 6y ago
  Maybe the argument is that you don't need to declare a war to start one?
- samatman 6y ago
  Please don't be naive. The workaround, for at least fifty years, has simply been for the President to start a war without going through the formality of declaring one. Congress could probably put a stop to it after the fact. We don't know this for sure, because thus far they just rubber-stamp it. Military-industrial money flows into everyone's district, by design.

justapassenger 6y ago

> President who was elected in a large part because of a Facebook board member. This is super naive thinking that ignores real huge issues in USA around inequality.

akhilcacharya 6y ago
Inequality? What exactly do you mean?

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

newen 6y ago

Trump wasn't elected because of magic mind hacking by Facebook or whatever. He appealed to issues that people were concerned about, whatever you may think of those issues, and so they voted for him.

kevin_thibedeau 6y ago
Watch the latest Triumph bit from the Colbert show to see the mentality of Trump supporters. We are living in an idiocracy now. 51% of Americans have no critical thinking skills. The "issues" are whatever you can use to trigger an emotional response from someone who is easily manipulated.
- Alupis 6y ago
  > Watch the latest Triumph bit from the Colbert show to see the mentality of Trump supporters Colbert has built a career upon exaggerating and editorializing politics. He is an entertainer and comedian, not an analyst. He is hardly a sound source for any real political insight. > The "issues" are whatever you can use to trigger an emotional response from someone who is easily manipulated. I think the same can be said about both political ideologies in the US. Emotional issues are far easier to get worked up about, even if there is no easy solution to the "issue" at hand. To claim only 51% of the country falls into this category, and to imply it's only one political ideology, is disingenuous at best. Particularly when you lead your post with something a comedian said on a late night TV show, ie. the very same emotional appeal you rail against.
  - jessaustin 6y ago
    I think the same can be said about both political ideologies in the US. Definitely. So much this, that I wonder if "both" is even the right word? So much sound and fury, and somehow Congress votes nearly unanimously to give rich people trillions in response to a pandemic, while doing nothing about health care. Somehow we're spending $750B on the military every year, more than the next fifteen nations combined, with our increase this year dwarfing Russia's total spending. Somehow in the coming election we have a confused loudmouth old man from the urban northeast who likes draft deferments, non-consensual digital penetration, and criminal-panic race baiting, running against Trump.