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Pre Tim Cook, Apple just out-innovated, not strong armed. Terrible. I really wish they were an alternative to Facebook/Google.

scarface74 6y ago
Because the Watch, the AirPods, are nothing - even though they both make more in revenue than the iPods at peak. The iPad is much better than the pre-Cook iPad 2. Apple’s processor lines are head and shoulders above the competition and the ARM Macs will probably be some combination of faster, cheaper, more power efficient than any x86 PC. And then we have Epic. Selling Carlton Dances with virtual currency.
- pjmlp 6y ago
  The problem are all those GNU/Linux users that bought into Apple's ecosystem because UNIX without being really part of the Apple eco-system culture. Now they complain, well should have spent money supporting GNU/Linux OEMs instead. Same applies to Epic, fine with console restrictions, thinking that they can play their weight everywhere Tim feels like it.
  - belval 6y ago
    Linux user here, bold of you to assume that my workplace gave me any kind of choice in the matter.
  - scarface74 6y ago
    To quote another part of the citation. Epic tried that with Apple. https://bgr.com/2020/09/17/fortnite-lawsuit-apple-epic-games-threats-revenue/# https://bgr.com/2020/09/17/fortnite-lawsuit-apple-epic-games... One particularly interesting tidbit from Schmid is that Epic would routinely threaten to release Fortnite updates on competing platforms first if Apple didn’t “accommodate their requests.” Schmid also said Epic on a number of occasions threatened to “terminate its relationship with Apple and remove its games” from the App Store if Apple didn’t comply with the company’s demands. Apple called their bluff.
- brailsafe 6y ago
  I believe the parent said they just out-innovated, rather than also strong-arming others.
  - scarface74 6y ago
    Apple did “strong arm” carriers to release their grip over customers and prevent them from installing their own bloatware, and allowing their customers to install updates directly.
    - Nullabillity 6y ago
      Yes, they strong-armed carriers into only installing Apple's bloatware, and only allowing Apple to control updates. The user still didn't gain anything.
      - scarface74 6y ago
        The user didn’t gain anything from Apple sending updates to all of its customers globally on phones up to five years old without having to wait on the carriers like Android users do?
- BLKNSLVR 6y ago
  Cheaper you say?
  - scarface74 6y ago
    Where can I get an equivalent tablet or laptop with the performance and specs of a $329 iPad - yes it can use any 3rd party Bluetooth keyboard and mouse. The iPad Air is also more performant than most laptops being sold abd it’s cheaper.
- mhh__ 6y ago
  Holding up the Apple Watch as an example of apple being innovative is a bit weak no? Maybe I'm just a pleb but a smartwatch is a toy, as opposed to the iPhone was a real innovation. I would use it for running telemetry, but I'm not aware of one that just does telemetry - I get a message on the little internet on my wrist, so I get the big internet out of my pocket to read it?
  - scarface74 6y ago
    > I get a message on the little internet on my wrist, so I get the big internet out of my pocket to read it? “No Wireless. Less Space than the Nomad. Lame”. In the pre-Covid days. I loved being able to take my cellular Apple Watch to the gym and leave my phone in the car. I could listen to music and podcasts check my heart rate, make and receive calls and messages. I would swim with it. Run with it, etc. and leave my phone at home. You could tap quick - yes/no replies or if someone asks you do you want $X or $Y, it will give you those two choices as quick replies. You can also dictate replies. I find my phone unusable when I’m working out. I sweat like a pig in heat. Any sensitive capacitive touch display is unusable. Even now, I use my Watch as a remote for my AppleTV while I’m working out in my home gym. That’s not even to mention in December with Apple Fitness, the on screen workouts will be able to automatically activate the appropriate workout on the watch and granularly record and show your stats. My wife would often leave her phone in the car when she was out and about. As far as the phone. Even in 2007, there were already 1 billion phones being sold a year. Jobs said he wanted the iPhone to capture 1% - 10 million during the first year. Now there are close to 5 billion phones being sold a year. There isn’t really any conceivable way that anything will have the ubiquity of the smart phone market at 90%+ penetration in the developed world and even 70%+ in the developing world. What we call a “phone” may change. But the smart phone market is a once in a lifetime opportunity. But we also have objective measures. 1. Did Apple create a new successful product line - success measured by revenue? As I said before, the revenue is higher than the iPods and will have a longer product life cycle. http://www.asymco.com/2019/12/12/ipods-pro/ http://www.asymco.com/2019/12/12/ipods-pro/ http://www.asymco.com/2020/09/17/apple-watch-at-5/ http://www.asymco.com/2020/09/17/apple-watch-at-5/ 2. We can also judge it technically. The Apple Watch has the fastest processor in the industry for a device its size, it has an always on display, heart rate monitor, GPS, cellular, WiFi, Bluetooth, U1 chip, ECG, altimeter, 16GB of RAM - o your wrist.
CGamesPlay 6y ago
This is completely untrue. There are countless stories of Jobs strong-arming companies to get what he wanted. I do agree that the innovation has gone down, but the strong-arming has always been there.
dbt00 6y ago
https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-15400984 https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-15400984
- mhh__ 6y ago
  He also vowed to destroy Dropbox too.
logicOnly 6y ago
You mean "out marketed". Apple is notoriously slow to change.

scarface74 6y ago

Because the Watch, the AirPods, are nothing - even though they both make more in revenue than the iPods at peak. The iPad is much better than the pre-Cook iPad 2. Apple’s processor lines are head and shoulders above the competition and the ARM Macs will probably be some combination of faster, cheaper, more power efficient than any x86 PC. And then we have Epic. Selling Carlton Dances with virtual currency.

pjmlp 6y ago
The problem are all those GNU/Linux users that bought into Apple's ecosystem because UNIX without being really part of the Apple eco-system culture. Now they complain, well should have spent money supporting GNU/Linux OEMs instead. Same applies to Epic, fine with console restrictions, thinking that they can play their weight everywhere Tim feels like it.
- belval 6y ago
  Linux user here, bold of you to assume that my workplace gave me any kind of choice in the matter.
- scarface74 6y ago
  To quote another part of the citation. Epic tried that with Apple. https://bgr.com/2020/09/17/fortnite-lawsuit-apple-epic-games-threats-revenue/# https://bgr.com/2020/09/17/fortnite-lawsuit-apple-epic-games... One particularly interesting tidbit from Schmid is that Epic would routinely threaten to release Fortnite updates on competing platforms first if Apple didn’t “accommodate their requests.” Schmid also said Epic on a number of occasions threatened to “terminate its relationship with Apple and remove its games” from the App Store if Apple didn’t comply with the company’s demands. Apple called their bluff.
brailsafe 6y ago
I believe the parent said they just out-innovated, rather than also strong-arming others.
- scarface74 6y ago
  Apple did “strong arm” carriers to release their grip over customers and prevent them from installing their own bloatware, and allowing their customers to install updates directly.
  - Nullabillity 6y ago
    Yes, they strong-armed carriers into only installing Apple's bloatware, and only allowing Apple to control updates. The user still didn't gain anything.
    - scarface74 6y ago
      The user didn’t gain anything from Apple sending updates to all of its customers globally on phones up to five years old without having to wait on the carriers like Android users do?
BLKNSLVR 6y ago
Cheaper you say?
- scarface74 6y ago
  Where can I get an equivalent tablet or laptop with the performance and specs of a $329 iPad - yes it can use any 3rd party Bluetooth keyboard and mouse. The iPad Air is also more performant than most laptops being sold abd it’s cheaper.
mhh__ 6y ago
Holding up the Apple Watch as an example of apple being innovative is a bit weak no? Maybe I'm just a pleb but a smartwatch is a toy, as opposed to the iPhone was a real innovation. I would use it for running telemetry, but I'm not aware of one that just does telemetry - I get a message on the little internet on my wrist, so I get the big internet out of my pocket to read it?
- scarface74 6y ago
  > I get a message on the little internet on my wrist, so I get the big internet out of my pocket to read it? “No Wireless. Less Space than the Nomad. Lame”. In the pre-Covid days. I loved being able to take my cellular Apple Watch to the gym and leave my phone in the car. I could listen to music and podcasts check my heart rate, make and receive calls and messages. I would swim with it. Run with it, etc. and leave my phone at home. You could tap quick - yes/no replies or if someone asks you do you want $X or $Y, it will give you those two choices as quick replies. You can also dictate replies. I find my phone unusable when I’m working out. I sweat like a pig in heat. Any sensitive capacitive touch display is unusable. Even now, I use my Watch as a remote for my AppleTV while I’m working out in my home gym. That’s not even to mention in December with Apple Fitness, the on screen workouts will be able to automatically activate the appropriate workout on the watch and granularly record and show your stats. My wife would often leave her phone in the car when she was out and about. As far as the phone. Even in 2007, there were already 1 billion phones being sold a year. Jobs said he wanted the iPhone to capture 1% - 10 million during the first year. Now there are close to 5 billion phones being sold a year. There isn’t really any conceivable way that anything will have the ubiquity of the smart phone market at 90%+ penetration in the developed world and even 70%+ in the developing world. What we call a “phone” may change. But the smart phone market is a once in a lifetime opportunity. But we also have objective measures. 1. Did Apple create a new successful product line - success measured by revenue? As I said before, the revenue is higher than the iPods and will have a longer product life cycle. http://www.asymco.com/2019/12/12/ipods-pro/ http://www.asymco.com/2019/12/12/ipods-pro/ http://www.asymco.com/2020/09/17/apple-watch-at-5/ http://www.asymco.com/2020/09/17/apple-watch-at-5/ 2. We can also judge it technically. The Apple Watch has the fastest processor in the industry for a device its size, it has an always on display, heart rate monitor, GPS, cellular, WiFi, Bluetooth, U1 chip, ECG, altimeter, 16GB of RAM - o your wrist.

CGamesPlay 6y ago

This is completely untrue. There are countless stories of Jobs strong-arming companies to get what he wanted. I do agree that the innovation has gone down, but the strong-arming has always been there.

dbt00 6y ago

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-15400984 https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-15400984

mhh__ 6y ago
He also vowed to destroy Dropbox too.

logicOnly 6y ago

You mean "out marketed". Apple is notoriously slow to change.