4 ms·

You do realize whoever wrote the spec for this DRM now has free advertising to be hired for more projects and make bank. If Rockstar did it in house, I'm pretty

You do realize whoever wrote the spec for this DRM now has free advertising to be hired for more projects and make bank. If Rockstar did it in house, I'm pretty sure they're going to make a spinoff DRM company. Useless, stupid, whatever you want to call it, they're going to print fun-coupons now.

dylan604 6y ago
DRM is and always will be a cat&mouse game. The hacker that breaks this DRM will also get level up bonus for their resume. At that point, this theoretical business model you propose will no longer be such a valuable thing. Those fun-coupons will be as valuable as the Chuck E Cheese tickets recently discussed
- NoOneNew 6y ago
  Your argument can easily apply to locks, safes and general physical security. It will always be done. I've been hearing "DRM is will be useless soon" since the early 2000s. Many DRM companies are 10-30+ years old, with multiple international locations and many, many employees. Look, I appreciate the hobby and skills it takes to crack DRM as a logic puzzle. I used to work security integration and I may have had my own similar hobbies. But at the end of the day, the argument of "DRM is useless" is people truly saying, "I don't want to pay for things". Who likes to work for free? I don't and I'm sure as shit you won't work for free either. Do I like Rockstar? No. I think their games are shit from beginning to end. They're edgelord, teenage wish fulfillment trash. Do I respect when someone spends their time and wishes to get paid for it so they can continue their craft with a roof over their head and food on the table for them and their families? Yes. If you don't approve of mandatory crunch times, story lines or whatever anti-capitalist, anarchist, whatever manifesto you subscribe to... don't buy or play their stuff. Fun part about a capitalist system, the best way to hurt someone is to both ignore them and don't buy their stuff. Pirating their stuff, as a lot of folks like to mention, "Doesn't hurt the company". But it does give them reason to be more aggressive, issue lawsuits, get more press attention and generally be bigger assholes that spiral the system out of control. If they can make a profit, you bet your sweet ass they'll figure it out even if it's a long con. So yea, wait for DRM to go bye-bye. Let's see, RDR2 was in dev for around 7 years. You go ahead and work, for someone else, for 7 years on something, about 40 hours a weeks (more if you want to include the "controversial working conditions") and don't get paid during that entire time. Not on something YOU want to do. Something that someone else wants done for them. Do that, then come back to me with a real argument for people not to get paid for their work. We're not a society that runs off hugs and kisses.
  - the_af 6y ago
    > But at the end of the day, the argument of "DRM is useless" is people truly saying, "I don't want to pay for things". This is false. A lot of people oppose DRM because it's a nasty bit of software running on your hardware, or because it's unwieldy or plain doesn't work. Some people buy a game (or ebook, or whatever) then use a DRM-stripped version because it's better. And yes, some people play pirated games because they don't want to pay. But don't make it sound as if that was everyone. DRM sucks.
    - NoOneNew 6y ago
      Dude, that's the biggest load of crap and you know it. That's what everyone tells themselves so they sleep better at night and seem like some self-righteous Robin Hoods to the public. You pirate because you don't want to pay for it. People don't buy something, then go out of their way to potentially get a bit of illegal virus/malware induced "DRM-Free version". I was a teen back during Napster and Limewire days... goddamn it I'm old... You pirate because you don't want to pay for it. Stop acting like it's some great public service, saving the world, doing-the-right-thing cause. The folks that do the actual cracking, again, I actually respect for the skills. That kind of stuff is a real fun hobby. They share their work as a way to showoff. However, it's the users that get free-rides who I think are just ridiculous and delusional. "Oh, I pirate games as a political statement for anti-DRM because DRM is soooooo much worse on machines, and, and capitalism bad." Yea... okay. Everything I have is DRM-filth and I never noticed.
      - the_af 6y ago
        I don't really know what to tell you except you're wrong. People do what I claimed all the time, you just ignore it happens. > You pirate because you don't want to pay for it. I don't pirate games. > Oh, I pirate games as a political statement for anti-DRM because DRM is soooooo much worse on machines, and, and capitalism bad. Nice strawman there. Please try arguing about what was actually said, instead of trying to start a flame war. Thanks.
      - tetris11 6y ago
- peteradio 6y ago
  DRM that takes 1 year to crack is about as good as you can want. What percent of total sales takes place in the first year. If your proposed hacker finds the solution to this one, does that mean they have the general solution? Or does that indicate that this style of DRM in general takes 1 year to crack and is generally valuable?
  - NoOneNew 6y ago
    I know in the indie game field, ~95% of lifetime sales happen in the first year. But to be fair, they typically don't have the similar marketing power as a AAA. I'd venture 60% (gut/instinct). There must be a good reason for running sales even in the long term. That could also be skewed when you think of in-game purchases too. Cheaper year 2 or 3 purchases could be pushed for if they're banking on in-game purchases. Either way, pretty sure someone broke open an expensive bottle of champagne for a 1 year mark.

dylan604 6y ago

DRM is and always will be a cat&mouse game. The hacker that breaks this DRM will also get level up bonus for their resume. At that point, this theoretical business model you propose will no longer be such a valuable thing. Those fun-coupons will be as valuable as the Chuck E Cheese tickets recently discussed

NoOneNew 6y ago
Your argument can easily apply to locks, safes and general physical security. It will always be done. I've been hearing "DRM is will be useless soon" since the early 2000s. Many DRM companies are 10-30+ years old, with multiple international locations and many, many employees. Look, I appreciate the hobby and skills it takes to crack DRM as a logic puzzle. I used to work security integration and I may have had my own similar hobbies. But at the end of the day, the argument of "DRM is useless" is people truly saying, "I don't want to pay for things". Who likes to work for free? I don't and I'm sure as shit you won't work for free either. Do I like Rockstar? No. I think their games are shit from beginning to end. They're edgelord, teenage wish fulfillment trash. Do I respect when someone spends their time and wishes to get paid for it so they can continue their craft with a roof over their head and food on the table for them and their families? Yes. If you don't approve of mandatory crunch times, story lines or whatever anti-capitalist, anarchist, whatever manifesto you subscribe to... don't buy or play their stuff. Fun part about a capitalist system, the best way to hurt someone is to both ignore them and don't buy their stuff. Pirating their stuff, as a lot of folks like to mention, "Doesn't hurt the company". But it does give them reason to be more aggressive, issue lawsuits, get more press attention and generally be bigger assholes that spiral the system out of control. If they can make a profit, you bet your sweet ass they'll figure it out even if it's a long con. So yea, wait for DRM to go bye-bye. Let's see, RDR2 was in dev for around 7 years. You go ahead and work, for someone else, for 7 years on something, about 40 hours a weeks (more if you want to include the "controversial working conditions") and don't get paid during that entire time. Not on something YOU want to do. Something that someone else wants done for them. Do that, then come back to me with a real argument for people not to get paid for their work. We're not a society that runs off hugs and kisses.
- the_af 6y ago
  > But at the end of the day, the argument of "DRM is useless" is people truly saying, "I don't want to pay for things". This is false. A lot of people oppose DRM because it's a nasty bit of software running on your hardware, or because it's unwieldy or plain doesn't work. Some people buy a game (or ebook, or whatever) then use a DRM-stripped version because it's better. And yes, some people play pirated games because they don't want to pay. But don't make it sound as if that was everyone. DRM sucks.
  - NoOneNew 6y ago
    Dude, that's the biggest load of crap and you know it. That's what everyone tells themselves so they sleep better at night and seem like some self-righteous Robin Hoods to the public. You pirate because you don't want to pay for it. People don't buy something, then go out of their way to potentially get a bit of illegal virus/malware induced "DRM-Free version". I was a teen back during Napster and Limewire days... goddamn it I'm old... You pirate because you don't want to pay for it. Stop acting like it's some great public service, saving the world, doing-the-right-thing cause. The folks that do the actual cracking, again, I actually respect for the skills. That kind of stuff is a real fun hobby. They share their work as a way to showoff. However, it's the users that get free-rides who I think are just ridiculous and delusional. "Oh, I pirate games as a political statement for anti-DRM because DRM is soooooo much worse on machines, and, and capitalism bad." Yea... okay. Everything I have is DRM-filth and I never noticed.
    - the_af 6y ago
      I don't really know what to tell you except you're wrong. People do what I claimed all the time, you just ignore it happens. > You pirate because you don't want to pay for it. I don't pirate games. > Oh, I pirate games as a political statement for anti-DRM because DRM is soooooo much worse on machines, and, and capitalism bad. Nice strawman there. Please try arguing about what was actually said, instead of trying to start a flame war. Thanks.
    - tetris11 6y ago
peteradio 6y ago
DRM that takes 1 year to crack is about as good as you can want. What percent of total sales takes place in the first year. If your proposed hacker finds the solution to this one, does that mean they have the general solution? Or does that indicate that this style of DRM in general takes 1 year to crack and is generally valuable?
- NoOneNew 6y ago
  I know in the indie game field, ~95% of lifetime sales happen in the first year. But to be fair, they typically don't have the similar marketing power as a AAA. I'd venture 60% (gut/instinct). There must be a good reason for running sales even in the long term. That could also be skewed when you think of in-game purchases too. Cheaper year 2 or 3 purchases could be pushed for if they're banking on in-game purchases. Either way, pretty sure someone broke open an expensive bottle of champagne for a 1 year mark.