3 ms·

The taxi/bus isn't given a tablet with instructions to watch the tablet (monitoring the self driving), only to be accused later of not watching the road.

lhorie 6y ago
Are you saying this was the case here? Are you you familiar with the protocols used at the time or are you speculating? I see e.g. cruise and waymo SDVs around SF with only one person on board. What of those? My very layperson protocol would be "watch the road while the car is in motion, only use tablet when car is safely parked". My understanding is that SDVs store all the data it collects, so I see no reason to require operating a tablet while the vehicle is in motion. Correct me if I'm wrong.
- user5994461 6y ago
  Previous articles mentioned that the driver has some tablet device(s) to watch, to monitor what's happening with the AI. The last PR piece seems to omit that. Next piece maybe we will find out the driver was watching hulu on their phone on their lap... while reclassifying objects on the AI tablet also on their lap.
  - lhorie 6y ago
    Ok, but what I'm curious is whether the monitoring/classifying/whatever was done in real time with the vehicle in motion, or after the fact. Presumably one would be able to do a far better job at whatever they were doing when they are able to play back/slow down/pause different data channels from a trip at will? Because if the status quo is to poke at tablets in moving vehicles, how is anyone ok w/ cruise/waymo/whatever cars driving around SF?
    - toast0 6y ago
      > how is anyone ok w/ cruise/waymo/whatever cars driving around SF? California DMV has shown a lot better oversight of self-driving than Arizona. They had deregistered several Uber owned vehicles in 2016 [1], and have some reasonably specific rules. It's much more OK in SF than AZ. [1] https://www.theregister.com/2016/12/22/uber_selfdriving_cars_san_francisco/ https://www.theregister.com/2016/12/22/uber_selfdriving_cars...
- curryst 6y ago
  Unless Cruise has changed recently, they require a primary and backup person in the car, and the rules seemed strict. I remember they were super serious about it, iirc you weren't allowed to talk to either of the drivers after you put your seatbelt on (or maybe it was after the car was on?). SF is also an easier place to be watching an SDV in the sense that there's more happening to keep your mind occupied (weird intersections, construction, people doing stupid things). It's a lot easier to lose focus when you're watching a car drive itself around deserted highways in the middle of the night.
  - lhorie 6y ago
    > Unless Cruise has changed recently I can't say much about what their actual protocols are supposed to be, I can only offer my personal anecdata. I do occasionally see cruise cars around the Japan Town area with only one person in the car. They often park at the safeway across geary. The waymo cars, I see them roaming around closer to downtown, also with single driver, though they don't seem to concentrate in any particular area that I can tell. I also occasionally see unbranded SDVs, sometimes w/ two people, sometimes w/ one. Not sure which company those are from. > SF is also an easier place to be watching an SDV Well, from a regulatory perspective, one shouldn't be able to get away with saying "well I was not in a crowded area to keep me attentive, that's why the accident happened". I'd even argue that if the job involves looking at a tablet while the car is motion, then being in a crowded area would make things _more_ dangerous.

lhorie 6y ago

Are you saying this was the case here? Are you you familiar with the protocols used at the time or are you speculating? I see e.g. cruise and waymo SDVs around SF with only one person on board. What of those? My very layperson protocol would be "watch the road while the car is in motion, only use tablet when car is safely parked". My understanding is that SDVs store all the data it collects, so I see no reason to require operating a tablet while the vehicle is in motion. Correct me if I'm wrong.

user5994461 6y ago
Previous articles mentioned that the driver has some tablet device(s) to watch, to monitor what's happening with the AI. The last PR piece seems to omit that. Next piece maybe we will find out the driver was watching hulu on their phone on their lap... while reclassifying objects on the AI tablet also on their lap.
- lhorie 6y ago
  Ok, but what I'm curious is whether the monitoring/classifying/whatever was done in real time with the vehicle in motion, or after the fact. Presumably one would be able to do a far better job at whatever they were doing when they are able to play back/slow down/pause different data channels from a trip at will? Because if the status quo is to poke at tablets in moving vehicles, how is anyone ok w/ cruise/waymo/whatever cars driving around SF?
  - toast0 6y ago
    > how is anyone ok w/ cruise/waymo/whatever cars driving around SF? California DMV has shown a lot better oversight of self-driving than Arizona. They had deregistered several Uber owned vehicles in 2016 [1], and have some reasonably specific rules. It's much more OK in SF than AZ. [1] https://www.theregister.com/2016/12/22/uber_selfdriving_cars_san_francisco/ https://www.theregister.com/2016/12/22/uber_selfdriving_cars...
curryst 6y ago
Unless Cruise has changed recently, they require a primary and backup person in the car, and the rules seemed strict. I remember they were super serious about it, iirc you weren't allowed to talk to either of the drivers after you put your seatbelt on (or maybe it was after the car was on?). SF is also an easier place to be watching an SDV in the sense that there's more happening to keep your mind occupied (weird intersections, construction, people doing stupid things). It's a lot easier to lose focus when you're watching a car drive itself around deserted highways in the middle of the night.
- lhorie 6y ago
  > Unless Cruise has changed recently I can't say much about what their actual protocols are supposed to be, I can only offer my personal anecdata. I do occasionally see cruise cars around the Japan Town area with only one person in the car. They often park at the safeway across geary. The waymo cars, I see them roaming around closer to downtown, also with single driver, though they don't seem to concentrate in any particular area that I can tell. I also occasionally see unbranded SDVs, sometimes w/ two people, sometimes w/ one. Not sure which company those are from. > SF is also an easier place to be watching an SDV Well, from a regulatory perspective, one shouldn't be able to get away with saying "well I was not in a crowded area to keep me attentive, that's why the accident happened". I'd even argue that if the job involves looking at a tablet while the car is motion, then being in a crowded area would make things _more_ dangerous.