4 ms·

Most Facebook staff believe company NOT responsible for curbing election disinfo

19 points by Kroeler 6y ago

camillomiller 6y ago
Denial. When people ask how can software engineers in companies like Facebook feel no sense of responsibility about what their building, is that they just trapped in a mechanism of denial. There is NO WAY that someone can otherwise be a well-educated computer scientist and at the same time think that anything Facebook does is acceptable for our society at large, or that it’s having any meaningful positive impact on society. And no, save me the “I can keep up with my family and friends around the world” bullshit.
justaguy88 6y ago
Facebook is on the road to becoming 4chan
- PeterCorless 6y ago
  More akin to Encyclopedia Dramatica, but point taken.
Barrin92 6y ago
I mean at least half of the employees seem to believe it so that's not bad I guess, but I honestly would like to hear what justification the other half has. Facebook is in the business of processing and distributing information, so dealing with disinformation seems to be in their courtyard. Do these people also think banks have no responsibility to prevent scams or fraudulent transactions, or that Amazon or Ebay have no responsibility to detect fraudulent vendors? What confuses me about internet platforms and their relationship to responsibility is, we've always had platforms. If a barkeeper serves minors alcohol or someone starts some illegal business in the backroom, you're probably on the hook. Do internet giants just get an excuse because they're huge?
- PeterCorless 6y ago
  The problem is Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act absolves the platforms from having to regulate decency on their platforms. https://www.eff.org/issues/cda230#:~:text=47%20U.S.C.,of%20the%20Communication%20Decency%20Act&text=Section%20230%20says%20that%20%22No,%C2%A7%20230 https://www.eff.org/issues/cda230#:~:text=47%20U.S.C.,of%20t...).
- SamReidHughes 6y ago
  If they were to actually ban disinformation, they would have to ban mainstream news sources. They'd also have to ban the political campaigns.
vmception 6y ago
Some people read that prompt and think legally not responsible Some people read that prompt and think socially not responsible Some people read that prompt and think socially not responsible in different countries Some people read that prompt and think legally and socially not responsible So it is prudent to understand that not everyone is answering the same question
aNoob7000 6y ago
What scares me is the sheer amount of conspiracy stuff on Facebook. My dad is on Facebook, he's 80, and the stuff he talks to me about on the phone is just amazing. I initially thought it was only him, but then my sister-in-law's mom started sending me videos, and I was faced with the same crazy stuff. I'm not sure what groups my dad is in or how they contact him, but damn there are a lot of old folks talking about all the same crazy stuff. I really wish Facebook would address some of this crazy nonsense. I can't tell you the number of times I've had to tell my dad that it is not George Soros or Bill Gates behind the conspiracy. Sorry for rambling on...
- PeterCorless 6y ago
  No, this is the danger we are in. People are letting the "marketplace of ideas" try to sort things out. However, this is like letting a disease ravage a population until it achieves herd immunity. If it has no natural immunity, it never will. Humans do NOT have a natural immunity to propaganda. They are carriers for it. We are the mosquitos of the malarial swamp of misinformation that is plaguing the planet currently. Many folks at Facebook know the terrible plight we are in. But there are enough people not wanting to rock the boat currently that they have not felt the urgency to change. It feels like we are reaching a breaking point, though.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - sharkmerry 6y ago
    I think "marketplace of ideas" fails as soon as you have curated feeds.
  - goldenManatee 6y ago
    They’re notorious for yes men
- bzb5 6y ago
  The alternative is Facebook being the arbiters of truth. I wouldn’t want them to be that, and they probably don’t want to be that either.
betwixthewires 6y ago
They're not.
betwixthewires 6y ago
They're not. People can share whatever nonsense with one another that they like.
- klyrs 6y ago
  Even if those "people" are foreign governments peddling divisive propaganda. The founders are truly smiling down on our unrelenting commitment to free speech. /s
Tagbert 6y ago
The problem is that the algorithms reinforce ideas by feeding in more and more. The crazier it is the more it reinforces. This is Facebook’s fault. They should feel responsible for this affect.
millstone 6y ago
This was a survey done by Blind. For those who do not know, Blind is a social network that reveals your employer but hides your identity. Blind members are self-selecting, and the site is chock full of trolls. So this tell us nothing about what "Most Facebook staff" actually think. The survey respondents may even be lying about currently working at Facebook. I like Blind but we should be realistic about what it is.

19 points by Kroeler 6y ago

Denial. When people ask how can software engineers in companies like Facebook feel no sense of responsibility about what their building, is that they just trapped in a mechanism of denial. There is NO WAY that someone can otherwise be a well-educated computer scientist and at the same time think that anything Facebook does is acceptable for our society at large, or that it’s having any meaningful positive impact on society. And no, save me the “I can keep up with my family and friends around the world” bullshit.

justaguy88 6y ago

Facebook is on the road to becoming 4chan

PeterCorless 6y ago
More akin to Encyclopedia Dramatica, but point taken.

Barrin92 6y ago

I mean at least half of the employees seem to believe it so that's not bad I guess, but I honestly would like to hear what justification the other half has. Facebook is in the business of processing and distributing information, so dealing with disinformation seems to be in their courtyard. Do these people also think banks have no responsibility to prevent scams or fraudulent transactions, or that Amazon or Ebay have no responsibility to detect fraudulent vendors? What confuses me about internet platforms and their relationship to responsibility is, we've always had platforms. If a barkeeper serves minors alcohol or someone starts some illegal business in the backroom, you're probably on the hook. Do internet giants just get an excuse because they're huge?

PeterCorless 6y ago
The problem is Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act absolves the platforms from having to regulate decency on their platforms. https://www.eff.org/issues/cda230#:~:text=47%20U.S.C.,of%20the%20Communication%20Decency%20Act&text=Section%20230%20says%20that%20%22No,%C2%A7%20230 https://www.eff.org/issues/cda230#:~:text=47%20U.S.C.,of%20t...).
SamReidHughes 6y ago
If they were to actually ban disinformation, they would have to ban mainstream news sources. They'd also have to ban the political campaigns.

vmception 6y ago

Some people read that prompt and think legally not responsible Some people read that prompt and think socially not responsible Some people read that prompt and think socially not responsible in different countries Some people read that prompt and think legally and socially not responsible So it is prudent to understand that not everyone is answering the same question

aNoob7000 6y ago

What scares me is the sheer amount of conspiracy stuff on Facebook. My dad is on Facebook, he's 80, and the stuff he talks to me about on the phone is just amazing. I initially thought it was only him, but then my sister-in-law's mom started sending me videos, and I was faced with the same crazy stuff. I'm not sure what groups my dad is in or how they contact him, but damn there are a lot of old folks talking about all the same crazy stuff. I really wish Facebook would address some of this crazy nonsense. I can't tell you the number of times I've had to tell my dad that it is not George Soros or Bill Gates behind the conspiracy. Sorry for rambling on...

PeterCorless 6y ago
No, this is the danger we are in. People are letting the "marketplace of ideas" try to sort things out. However, this is like letting a disease ravage a population until it achieves herd immunity. If it has no natural immunity, it never will. Humans do NOT have a natural immunity to propaganda. They are carriers for it. We are the mosquitos of the malarial swamp of misinformation that is plaguing the planet currently. Many folks at Facebook know the terrible plight we are in. But there are enough people not wanting to rock the boat currently that they have not felt the urgency to change. It feels like we are reaching a breaking point, though.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- sharkmerry 6y ago
  I think "marketplace of ideas" fails as soon as you have curated feeds.
- goldenManatee 6y ago
  They’re notorious for yes men
bzb5 6y ago
The alternative is Facebook being the arbiters of truth. I wouldn’t want them to be that, and they probably don’t want to be that either.

betwixthewires 6y ago

They're not.

betwixthewires 6y ago

They're not. People can share whatever nonsense with one another that they like.

klyrs 6y ago
Even if those "people" are foreign governments peddling divisive propaganda. The founders are truly smiling down on our unrelenting commitment to free speech. /s

Tagbert 6y ago

The problem is that the algorithms reinforce ideas by feeding in more and more. The crazier it is the more it reinforces. This is Facebook’s fault. They should feel responsible for this affect.

millstone 6y ago

This was a survey done by Blind. For those who do not know, Blind is a social network that reveals your employer but hides your identity. Blind members are self-selecting, and the site is chock full of trolls. So this tell us nothing about what "Most Facebook staff" actually think. The survey respondents may even be lying about currently working at Facebook. I like Blind but we should be realistic about what it is.