4 ms·

I’m fairly certain they are the exact same ones confiscated. It’s a near blatant knockoff of Apple’s patented designs. Now should Apple be able to get said all

I’m fairly certain they are the exact same ones confiscated. It’s a near blatant knockoff of Apple’s patented designs. Now should Apple be able to get said all encompassing design patents? That’s a different debate.

elmo2you 6y ago
Looks like rather generic design to me, especially since a substantial parts of are basically dictated by the human anatomy. So regardless the questionable nature of design patents in the first place, this design certainly does not warrant such patents. But in any case, that's for a court to decide. Does the USA actively seize other products that violate patents without a court case? How would they even determine infringement? I don't remember Apple winning any court case against OnePlus, so that can't be the reason for this seizure. If these buds were seized as counterfeits, then there had to be an express intent to sell these as imitation Apple products, which I find rather hard to believe (for starters because the packaging isn't the same). Also, when producers remove any brand markings, like logos and other distinctive material unique to that company, knock-off/imitation cases are always weak. For good reasons too, just as with trademarking generic names. You don't want a single company to dictate the use of generic things. Maybe most import is that this seizure will unlikely have happened on a whim. Almost certainly, somebody has requested for this to happen. That itself should give rise to some serious questions. Because it would likely make this a rather blatant (and probably unlawful) case of economical warfare. To use the extraordinary powers of border guards for that purpose, without any court case, is downright corrupt. Like mafia style corruption. I wonder which highest ranking official signed off on this. That person has some explaining to do, for he/she just made the USA look like a tinpot dictatorship. Ignorant too, to boast about it on their web site. Unless that's done intentional, as propaganda to convince the locals this was legal or good "to protect America". People abroad will likely have a very different view on that. What the American government often forgets, in its self-centred and mostly domestic focus, is that the rest of the world is observing things like these. Behaviour like this always has consequences, even if it can take a while.
- toast0 6y ago
  US Customs has been checking international shipments for counterfeit goods and other contraband since a long time. It's part of what a Customs agency customarily does. How else would you prevent counterfeit goods from entering a country? For domestic mad counterfeits, it's possible to enforce laws (or court orders) prohibiting manufacture, but that's not really the case when the products are made overseas.
  - elmo2you 6y ago
    You said that correctly: counterfeit products. While Apple fanboys no doubt will claim that these OnePlus products are counterfeits of Apple products, that's mostly just their ignorance or wishful thinking talking. From what I can see, there is no actual counterfeiting involved here. This product is both generic enough in design and not brandishing any Apple specific markings. Also comes with a box that makes it clear it's not an Apple product. Sure, Apple might not like that people can walk around with something that looks similar to their overprices exclusive stuff, for a lot less. But that's not a valid definition of counterfeit. You see, it's missing the "fraudulent" part in the "fraudulent imitation" definition of counterfeit. Maybe Apple should not have made their things look that generic. They might have a case if a logo or other protected asset was imitated. But this is not a clear-cut case. Rather one that should at least have a court rule on first. The elephant in the room here is the USA showing what it can do (pretty much with impunity, short term at least) to a Chinese company. Long term, that will prove incredibly dumb and costly for the USA. But not a single person in government, nor any American company executive, will look that far ahead or even remotely care. By that time they are already long gone, pockets filled with short term gains and someone else to deal with the negative consequences.
    - toast0 6y ago
      Sorry, I didn't mention it earlier, since you seemed upset by Customs in general. This certainly appears to be a false positive, and it will most likely get resolved in favor of the importer, unless there's some trademark action we're all unaware of. The shipment is still gonna be delayed though, and that delay is not likely to be compensated; it's a risk in the system (along with many other risks of loss or delay in international shipping) It would probably be better for CBP not to publish their seizures like this until they had gone through the process.

elmo2you 6y ago

Looks like rather generic design to me, especially since a substantial parts of are basically dictated by the human anatomy. So regardless the questionable nature of design patents in the first place, this design certainly does not warrant such patents. But in any case, that's for a court to decide. Does the USA actively seize other products that violate patents without a court case? How would they even determine infringement? I don't remember Apple winning any court case against OnePlus, so that can't be the reason for this seizure. If these buds were seized as counterfeits, then there had to be an express intent to sell these as imitation Apple products, which I find rather hard to believe (for starters because the packaging isn't the same). Also, when producers remove any brand markings, like logos and other distinctive material unique to that company, knock-off/imitation cases are always weak. For good reasons too, just as with trademarking generic names. You don't want a single company to dictate the use of generic things. Maybe most import is that this seizure will unlikely have happened on a whim. Almost certainly, somebody has requested for this to happen. That itself should give rise to some serious questions. Because it would likely make this a rather blatant (and probably unlawful) case of economical warfare. To use the extraordinary powers of border guards for that purpose, without any court case, is downright corrupt. Like mafia style corruption. I wonder which highest ranking official signed off on this. That person has some explaining to do, for he/she just made the USA look like a tinpot dictatorship. Ignorant too, to boast about it on their web site. Unless that's done intentional, as propaganda to convince the locals this was legal or good "to protect America". People abroad will likely have a very different view on that. What the American government often forgets, in its self-centred and mostly domestic focus, is that the rest of the world is observing things like these. Behaviour like this always has consequences, even if it can take a while.

toast0 6y ago
US Customs has been checking international shipments for counterfeit goods and other contraband since a long time. It's part of what a Customs agency customarily does. How else would you prevent counterfeit goods from entering a country? For domestic mad counterfeits, it's possible to enforce laws (or court orders) prohibiting manufacture, but that's not really the case when the products are made overseas.
- elmo2you 6y ago
  You said that correctly: counterfeit products. While Apple fanboys no doubt will claim that these OnePlus products are counterfeits of Apple products, that's mostly just their ignorance or wishful thinking talking. From what I can see, there is no actual counterfeiting involved here. This product is both generic enough in design and not brandishing any Apple specific markings. Also comes with a box that makes it clear it's not an Apple product. Sure, Apple might not like that people can walk around with something that looks similar to their overprices exclusive stuff, for a lot less. But that's not a valid definition of counterfeit. You see, it's missing the "fraudulent" part in the "fraudulent imitation" definition of counterfeit. Maybe Apple should not have made their things look that generic. They might have a case if a logo or other protected asset was imitated. But this is not a clear-cut case. Rather one that should at least have a court rule on first. The elephant in the room here is the USA showing what it can do (pretty much with impunity, short term at least) to a Chinese company. Long term, that will prove incredibly dumb and costly for the USA. But not a single person in government, nor any American company executive, will look that far ahead or even remotely care. By that time they are already long gone, pockets filled with short term gains and someone else to deal with the negative consequences.
  - toast0 6y ago
    Sorry, I didn't mention it earlier, since you seemed upset by Customs in general. This certainly appears to be a false positive, and it will most likely get resolved in favor of the importer, unless there's some trademark action we're all unaware of. The shipment is still gonna be delayed though, and that delay is not likely to be compensated; it's a risk in the system (along with many other risks of loss or delay in international shipping) It would probably be better for CBP not to publish their seizures like this until they had gone through the process.