6 ms·

Fifth largest economy in the world. We must be doing something right.

almost_usual 6y ago
nice weather and nature that’s burning?
tjbiddle 6y ago
39 million people also places it at #37 in population if it were a country. Throw in Hollywood, Silicon Valley, piggy-backing off the US as a whole, and having a beautiful coastline and great social culture. What do you expect? I do everything I can to minimize my involvement with California for my businesses.
- dragonwriter 6y ago
  > piggy-backing off the US as a whole The US as a whole net extracts from California; the piggy-backing goes the other way.
- asdfaoeu 6y ago
  Sounds like they should increase taxes in California to encourage businesses to move to other states.
- gamblor956 6y ago
  California contributes more in taxes than it gets back in federal spending. Kansas, et al, owe their continued solvency to California's continued generosity.
zbrozek 6y ago
Success is due to nice weather. Now that that's gone, well...
- nerbert 6y ago
  Tell that to Mediterranean countries.
- dragonwriter 6y ago
  > Success is due to nice weather. If by that you mean a combination of soil and climate suitable for some of the most productive agriculture in North America, that's true. Otherwise it's more a series of other industries, starting with extractive (1849 wasn't known for a “nice weather rush”) but more recently mostly creative & technological. > Now that that's gone, well... It wasn't gone during the long drought, and it's not now.
  - oehtXRwMkIs 6y ago
    You're actually underestimating the agricultural output of California, it's the most agriculturally productive place (mainly Central Valley I believe) in the history of civilization.
beaner 6y ago
California has a monopoly on the entire mild-weathered west coast of the United States. Its government is permitted to be less effective and less efficient because people are willing to pay extra for its natural geography.
- shuckles 6y ago
  Capital being more abundant than mild weathered land is bullish for the state, no?
  - beaner 6y ago
    I'm not sure what you mean. I think so, but beside the point. I was replying to the idea that California government "must be doing something right," which is untrue.
    - shuckles 6y ago
      California’s government is overly optimized to protect the environment in the short term, which, per this point, may be a good trade.
      - beaner 6y ago
        The point I was originally replying to was not about the environment, it was about the size of the economy. This isn't related.
- jayd16 6y ago
  So what you're saying is California can continue its current policies and be just fine?
  - almost_usual 6y ago
    Yeah, this smoke is great.
phobosanomaly 6y ago
With: 1. The largest public university system in the country (Cal State - 3rd largest on the planet) 2. The absolutely massive UC research machine 3. An established, inexpensive feeder system with the California Community Colleges (hello social mobility) 4. Plenty of world-class private universities (Cal Tech, Stanford, Claremont Colleges, Deep Springs) 5. Access to the Cali-Baja industrial cluster (California has a LOT of manufacturing, it's just in the other California) 6. Some insane levels of cultural diversity (many folks from different cultures can feel at home here - more so than say, Oklahoma) 7. Over 7 medical schools 8. Relatively cheap land in the fast-growing Inland Empire and the Antelope Valley (all it needs is a dash of HSR) 9. Massive agriculture in the San Fernando Valley 10. A massive aerospace industry (Antelope Valley - Skunkworks, etc.) 11. The port of Los Angeles is the largest port in the country followed by the second largest port in the country ....Long Beach, 9th largest is Oakland. 12. The San Diego biotech cluster with its ties to UCSD (Celera, which produced the first draft sequence of the human genome was up north in Alameda, California) California is an economic machine with infrastructure no other state in the country can come close to.
- almost_usual 6y ago
  The central valley is working class Trump country. The mountains are getaways for coastal wealth. You have some minorities that are disadvantaged who clean up after the coastal wealth or farm. Housing is near impossible and stopped at all costs to preserve inequality. If you grew up here you probably had to move, if you have kids here the chances are they won’t be able to afford a home without your help (assuming you’re a home owner). Welcome to California.
  - phobosanomaly 6y ago
    You and I might have a different experience of California Housing is actually very available and inexpensive in the inland areas, which are fast-growing (Inland Empire, Antelope Valley, etc.). Cheap housing in places like Palm Springs, plus the influx of coastal money has put a LOT of children of landscapers and restaurant workers, and hotel workers, etc. through the California public university system. California is a sanctuary state with an excellent community college system, so the children of those disadvantaged minorities have a definite shot of transferring to a school like Berkeley, or even a Cal State, which offers an excellent education at a reasonable (in a relative sense) price. The economy in the mountains is BOOMING right now, as that coastal wealth funnels into a myriad of small businesses.
jandrewrogers 6y ago
On a per capita basis, California's GDP is not remarkable and is significantly worse than some other States. Having a large economy is a function of having a large population, it doesn't imply an exceptionally productive economy. I'm a native Californian but I've never understood the odd "fifth largest economy!" flag waving given that it is a product of population size. The "doing something right" may not be the thing you are trying to imply.
- jayd16 6y ago
  >On a per capita basis, California's GDP is not remarkable and is significantly worse than some other States Per capita its still the 5th(6th if you include DC) highest and 30% more than the median state. I think people reference the fifth largest economy factoid because it also speaks to how Californian has several large industries from tech to agriculture. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_GDP_per_capita#Current https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territ...
- CalChris 6y ago
  Actually on a per capita GDP, California is 8th, 5th if you look at current rather real. Hey, we're right behind Wyoming and North Dakota. Shudder the thought. However, we're 7th in per capita income with Wyoming and North Dakota nowhere to be seen. Sounds like some states have an income distribution problem. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_GDP_per_capita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territ... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_GDP_per_capita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territ... I'm also a native California, born, bred and educated, and I've seen this U-Haul trucks headed for the border tripe every few years, this one from Stanford's (notoriously conservative) Hoover Institute. It's the usual right wing nonsense.
- dragonwriter 6y ago
  > On a per capita basis, California's GDP is not remarkable, and is significantly worse than some other States. It's #5 among states, a little over 7% behind #1 Massachusetts, and over 20% ahead of the US as a whole, and over double #50 Mississippi. > Having a large economy is a function of having a large population, it doesn't imply an exceptionally productive economy. California has both a large population and, on a per capita basis, an exceptionally productive economy among US states. It's true it's abstractly possible for the former to substitute for the latter in aggregate output measures, but that's not really the case for CA. https://www.statista.com/statistics/248063/per-capita-us-real-gross-domestic-product-gdp-by-state/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/248063/per-capita-us-rea...
ffggvv 6y ago
no that means something right happened decades ago and its still coasting off that.
- refurb 6y ago
  Exactly. New Jersey was also a powerhouse state 75 years ago. Been in a slow decline for the past few decades.
refurb 6y ago
I'd argue California's economic success is in spite of the government (or at least the government of the last 4 decades or so), not because of it.
primrose 6y ago
Detroit took decades to go bankrupt. Sometimes previous polices can have long term effects before diminishing.

nice weather and nature that’s burning?

39 million people also places it at #37 in population if it were a country. Throw in Hollywood, Silicon Valley, piggy-backing off the US as a whole, and having a beautiful coastline and great social culture. What do you expect? I do everything I can to minimize my involvement with California for my businesses.

dragonwriter 6y ago
> piggy-backing off the US as a whole The US as a whole net extracts from California; the piggy-backing goes the other way.
asdfaoeu 6y ago
Sounds like they should increase taxes in California to encourage businesses to move to other states.
gamblor956 6y ago
California contributes more in taxes than it gets back in federal spending. Kansas, et al, owe their continued solvency to California's continued generosity.

zbrozek 6y ago

Success is due to nice weather. Now that that's gone, well...

nerbert 6y ago
Tell that to Mediterranean countries.
dragonwriter 6y ago
> Success is due to nice weather. If by that you mean a combination of soil and climate suitable for some of the most productive agriculture in North America, that's true. Otherwise it's more a series of other industries, starting with extractive (1849 wasn't known for a “nice weather rush”) but more recently mostly creative & technological. > Now that that's gone, well... It wasn't gone during the long drought, and it's not now.
- oehtXRwMkIs 6y ago
  You're actually underestimating the agricultural output of California, it's the most agriculturally productive place (mainly Central Valley I believe) in the history of civilization.

beaner 6y ago

California has a monopoly on the entire mild-weathered west coast of the United States. Its government is permitted to be less effective and less efficient because people are willing to pay extra for its natural geography.

shuckles 6y ago
Capital being more abundant than mild weathered land is bullish for the state, no?
- beaner 6y ago
  I'm not sure what you mean. I think so, but beside the point. I was replying to the idea that California government "must be doing something right," which is untrue.
  - shuckles 6y ago
    California’s government is overly optimized to protect the environment in the short term, which, per this point, may be a good trade.
    - beaner 6y ago
      The point I was originally replying to was not about the environment, it was about the size of the economy. This isn't related.
jayd16 6y ago
So what you're saying is California can continue its current policies and be just fine?
- almost_usual 6y ago
  Yeah, this smoke is great.

phobosanomaly 6y ago

With: 1. The largest public university system in the country (Cal State - 3rd largest on the planet) 2. The absolutely massive UC research machine 3. An established, inexpensive feeder system with the California Community Colleges (hello social mobility) 4. Plenty of world-class private universities (Cal Tech, Stanford, Claremont Colleges, Deep Springs) 5. Access to the Cali-Baja industrial cluster (California has a LOT of manufacturing, it's just in the other California) 6. Some insane levels of cultural diversity (many folks from different cultures can feel at home here - more so than say, Oklahoma) 7. Over 7 medical schools 8. Relatively cheap land in the fast-growing Inland Empire and the Antelope Valley (all it needs is a dash of HSR) 9. Massive agriculture in the San Fernando Valley 10. A massive aerospace industry (Antelope Valley - Skunkworks, etc.) 11. The port of Los Angeles is the largest port in the country followed by the second largest port in the country ....Long Beach, 9th largest is Oakland. 12. The San Diego biotech cluster with its ties to UCSD (Celera, which produced the first draft sequence of the human genome was up north in Alameda, California) California is an economic machine with infrastructure no other state in the country can come close to.

almost_usual 6y ago
The central valley is working class Trump country. The mountains are getaways for coastal wealth. You have some minorities that are disadvantaged who clean up after the coastal wealth or farm. Housing is near impossible and stopped at all costs to preserve inequality. If you grew up here you probably had to move, if you have kids here the chances are they won’t be able to afford a home without your help (assuming you’re a home owner). Welcome to California.
- phobosanomaly 6y ago
  You and I might have a different experience of California Housing is actually very available and inexpensive in the inland areas, which are fast-growing (Inland Empire, Antelope Valley, etc.). Cheap housing in places like Palm Springs, plus the influx of coastal money has put a LOT of children of landscapers and restaurant workers, and hotel workers, etc. through the California public university system. California is a sanctuary state with an excellent community college system, so the children of those disadvantaged minorities have a definite shot of transferring to a school like Berkeley, or even a Cal State, which offers an excellent education at a reasonable (in a relative sense) price. The economy in the mountains is BOOMING right now, as that coastal wealth funnels into a myriad of small businesses.

jandrewrogers 6y ago

On a per capita basis, California's GDP is not remarkable and is significantly worse than some other States. Having a large economy is a function of having a large population, it doesn't imply an exceptionally productive economy. I'm a native Californian but I've never understood the odd "fifth largest economy!" flag waving given that it is a product of population size. The "doing something right" may not be the thing you are trying to imply.

jayd16 6y ago
>On a per capita basis, California's GDP is not remarkable and is significantly worse than some other States Per capita its still the 5th(6th if you include DC) highest and 30% more than the median state. I think people reference the fifth largest economy factoid because it also speaks to how Californian has several large industries from tech to agriculture. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_GDP_per_capita#Current https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territ...
CalChris 6y ago
Actually on a per capita GDP, California is 8th, 5th if you look at current rather real. Hey, we're right behind Wyoming and North Dakota. Shudder the thought. However, we're 7th in per capita income with Wyoming and North Dakota nowhere to be seen. Sounds like some states have an income distribution problem. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_GDP_per_capita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territ... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_GDP_per_capita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territ... I'm also a native California, born, bred and educated, and I've seen this U-Haul trucks headed for the border tripe every few years, this one from Stanford's (notoriously conservative) Hoover Institute. It's the usual right wing nonsense.
dragonwriter 6y ago
> On a per capita basis, California's GDP is not remarkable, and is significantly worse than some other States. It's #5 among states, a little over 7% behind #1 Massachusetts, and over 20% ahead of the US as a whole, and over double #50 Mississippi. > Having a large economy is a function of having a large population, it doesn't imply an exceptionally productive economy. California has both a large population and, on a per capita basis, an exceptionally productive economy among US states. It's true it's abstractly possible for the former to substitute for the latter in aggregate output measures, but that's not really the case for CA. https://www.statista.com/statistics/248063/per-capita-us-real-gross-domestic-product-gdp-by-state/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/248063/per-capita-us-rea...

ffggvv 6y ago

no that means something right happened decades ago and its still coasting off that.

refurb 6y ago
Exactly. New Jersey was also a powerhouse state 75 years ago. Been in a slow decline for the past few decades.

refurb 6y ago

I'd argue California's economic success is in spite of the government (or at least the government of the last 4 decades or so), not because of it.

primrose 6y ago

Detroit took decades to go bankrupt. Sometimes previous polices can have long term effects before diminishing.