6 ms·

The EU is nowhere as culturally unified as the U.S is. So the pool of resources available isn't as large. I'd also not be so quick on the regulation front. Loo

The EU is nowhere as culturally unified as the U.S is. So the pool of resources available isn't as large. I'd also not be so quick on the regulation front. Looking at the (lack of) environmental regulation in the US right about now or the absolute astonishing cost of any medical emergency, I'd say they went too far in the other direction.

0xfaded 6y ago
The lack of cultural unity thing is a curtain to hide behind. There's no reason Europe can't have a powerful federal government, other than it would result in transfers from the "export based economies" to the others.
- AsyncAwait 6y ago
  > There's no reason Europe can't have a powerful federal government Europe does not share a language in common, a culture in common, not even a currency in common. The "federal government" idea would be rejected by many out of hand. The history of bitter wars between European countries has not simply been forgotten and many would feel it encroaches on their sovereignty. Just look at the reaction to mild proposals for an EU armed force as an example, or the many "Euroskeptic" politicians going around. I think you underestimate what it takes to form a strong federal government.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
- pmachinery 6y ago
  The reason Europe can't have a powerful federal government is that most people in Europe quite rightly don't want one.
  - 0xfaded 6y ago
    This is obviously a massive topic, but from my vantage as a foreigner living in Europe is that Europe already has (and pays for) all features of a federal government with two exceptions. * Responsibility to implement treaties remains with the individual members. * No ability to tax or set fiscal policy. The advantage of a single set of laws is obvious. For starters I wouldn't be spending my Sunday reading a 500 page document on minor items describing how Denmark's implementation of an EU treaty differs from the treaty's wording. (Although it would cost the jobs of the people who produce such documents, and as such would fly in the face of the one central pillar of paneuropean identity). The ability to tax and set fiscal policy is needed to offset the imbalance created by the single currency. Another lengthy topic, but basically the assumption that every EU member should "export" is simply impossible. A normal currency system would correct a trade imbalance automatically. The euro systematically undervalues the cost of German output buy forcing their European neighbors to transact in the same currency. And then you have mafias, bankers, tax havens, uneven social nets, and a raft of other social problems that can only effectively be dealt with by a central government. The irony should not be lost that the American government has had better success battling the Italian mafia than the Italians have.
    - srtjstjsj 6y ago
      And who should pick the central government? Vote by population so that Germany is in charge? Minorities don't care well under powerful central government. Unless that government is a minority dictator tha terrorizes the majority. Would you enjoy being europe's version of an Uighur in China? > And then you have mafias, bankers, tax havens, uneven social nets, and a raft of other social problems that can only effectively be dealt with by a central government US has all these problems even worse than Europe except maybe the mafia next the mafia took over the government directly.
- jeroenhd 6y ago
  The lack of cultural unity is the reason people don't want a powerful federal government. With the turn the democratically elected Hungarian and Polish governments have taken the past few years, I sure hope there won't be a powerful federal EU government any time soon.
- srtjstjsj 6y ago
  Powerful federal government only exists on newly settled land or post genocide or under dictatorship. Germany tried that twice but the Americans stopped it. Either because the US didn't want that particular genocide or because they didn't want a unified Europe under european control.

0xfaded 6y ago

The lack of cultural unity thing is a curtain to hide behind. There's no reason Europe can't have a powerful federal government, other than it would result in transfers from the "export based economies" to the others.

AsyncAwait 6y ago
> There's no reason Europe can't have a powerful federal government Europe does not share a language in common, a culture in common, not even a currency in common. The "federal government" idea would be rejected by many out of hand. The history of bitter wars between European countries has not simply been forgotten and many would feel it encroaches on their sovereignty. Just look at the reaction to mild proposals for an EU armed force as an example, or the many "Euroskeptic" politicians going around. I think you underestimate what it takes to form a strong federal government.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
pmachinery 6y ago
The reason Europe can't have a powerful federal government is that most people in Europe quite rightly don't want one.
- 0xfaded 6y ago
  This is obviously a massive topic, but from my vantage as a foreigner living in Europe is that Europe already has (and pays for) all features of a federal government with two exceptions. * Responsibility to implement treaties remains with the individual members. * No ability to tax or set fiscal policy. The advantage of a single set of laws is obvious. For starters I wouldn't be spending my Sunday reading a 500 page document on minor items describing how Denmark's implementation of an EU treaty differs from the treaty's wording. (Although it would cost the jobs of the people who produce such documents, and as such would fly in the face of the one central pillar of paneuropean identity). The ability to tax and set fiscal policy is needed to offset the imbalance created by the single currency. Another lengthy topic, but basically the assumption that every EU member should "export" is simply impossible. A normal currency system would correct a trade imbalance automatically. The euro systematically undervalues the cost of German output buy forcing their European neighbors to transact in the same currency. And then you have mafias, bankers, tax havens, uneven social nets, and a raft of other social problems that can only effectively be dealt with by a central government. The irony should not be lost that the American government has had better success battling the Italian mafia than the Italians have.
  - srtjstjsj 6y ago
    And who should pick the central government? Vote by population so that Germany is in charge? Minorities don't care well under powerful central government. Unless that government is a minority dictator tha terrorizes the majority. Would you enjoy being europe's version of an Uighur in China? > And then you have mafias, bankers, tax havens, uneven social nets, and a raft of other social problems that can only effectively be dealt with by a central government US has all these problems even worse than Europe except maybe the mafia next the mafia took over the government directly.
jeroenhd 6y ago
The lack of cultural unity is the reason people don't want a powerful federal government. With the turn the democratically elected Hungarian and Polish governments have taken the past few years, I sure hope there won't be a powerful federal EU government any time soon.
srtjstjsj 6y ago
Powerful federal government only exists on newly settled land or post genocide or under dictatorship. Germany tried that twice but the Americans stopped it. Either because the US didn't want that particular genocide or because they didn't want a unified Europe under european control.