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- join Peace Corps and work entirely in Korean in a rural health center for two years with minimal English. Or that's how one used to do it. Stressful but effec

- join Peace Corps and work entirely in Korean in a rural health center for two years with minimal English. Or that's how one used to do it. Stressful but effective. - as with all foreign language speakers, the rules are subtly different for outsiders. Just copying native speakers can result in unpleasantness. In Korean, non-Koreans who "misuse" "panmal" (the blunt, informal speech level) by closely imitating friends can come across unintentionally as thuggish. There as elsewhere foreigners are held to higher standards.

irq11 6y ago
Can’t comment on Korean, but Japanese beginners worry far too much about politeness. It doesn’t help that the textbooks all start with a relatively stiff level of grammar, but Japanese students often become neurotic about it. If you’re a beginner, no reasonable human being is going to think anything nuanced about your choice of words. When was the last time you judged a non-native speaker of your own language for this level of subtlety? My advice is to do whatever it takes to be understood. You’re going to sound like a rude idiot. Make peace with it.
- tasogare 6y ago
  You are totally right. This is why I don’t even bother using polite form expect when I really need it: my interlocutor is glad I’m speaking more Japanese than he could speak English or my native language anyway. I would also add that speaking a Japanese that is too good can backfire, as native have then more expectations that go further than language (behavior), especially for East-Asian people. Keeping illusion of semi-(in)competence can be useful.
newsbinator 6y ago
> There as elsewhere foreigners are held to higher standards. I've found the reverse in Korea: the tyranny of low expectations. Often Koreans simply refuse to speak to me in any way, saying even a single word beyond, "I don't speak English".

irq11 6y ago

Can’t comment on Korean, but Japanese beginners worry far too much about politeness. It doesn’t help that the textbooks all start with a relatively stiff level of grammar, but Japanese students often become neurotic about it. If you’re a beginner, no reasonable human being is going to think anything nuanced about your choice of words. When was the last time you judged a non-native speaker of your own language for this level of subtlety? My advice is to do whatever it takes to be understood. You’re going to sound like a rude idiot. Make peace with it.

tasogare 6y ago
You are totally right. This is why I don’t even bother using polite form expect when I really need it: my interlocutor is glad I’m speaking more Japanese than he could speak English or my native language anyway. I would also add that speaking a Japanese that is too good can backfire, as native have then more expectations that go further than language (behavior), especially for East-Asian people. Keeping illusion of semi-(in)competence can be useful.

newsbinator 6y ago

> There as elsewhere foreigners are held to higher standards. I've found the reverse in Korea: the tyranny of low expectations. Often Koreans simply refuse to speak to me in any way, saying even a single word beyond, "I don't speak English".