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Job interviews in the IT world are a reason why I will go freelancing... Writing some algorithm No why should I? If I need an algorithm that must be fast I wil

by lampe3 6y ago

Job interviews in the IT world are a reason why I will go freelancing... Writing some algorithm No why should I? If I need an algorithm that must be fast I will look up a peace of code that is used and tested by other people. No I will not live google in front of you watching me. How is this a real world scenario? How came up with this? Like stupid questions like: How many log entries should a service have each hour? Yes this was a real question in a job interview. IT Job interviews are broken in so many ways. I refuse to live code or have this you now have X minutes to solve a problem stuff. Again this is not how I work and also I have never seen people work like that in the real world. Only in shitty teams with shitty organization and where they were thinking that they were agile because the sprint ends in 5 minutes... Here is the only way of interview I tolerate these days: 1) (optional) Have a call with HR 2) Talk with people from the team in an open way. Talk about real challenges and how the applicant can help in the challenges of the team. Check if the applicant will fit your team! Good team chemistry eats technical knowledge by 1000x. If you only take people because they know some algorithm you will most likely end up with something in Germany they call "fachidioten". They will solve the problem on a technical level but will bring with them 1000 other social, product and long term problems with them. 3) If you still not convinced that this person is good enough for your team then. Give that person a small challenge he/she can do at at any time she/he wants. 4) Let the applicant send you the solution and if you think it is okay then talk about the solution of the applicant and see how he/she reacts to criticism. Again a team that has good social skills and likes each other will eat every team were you have rock stars that think they are the best.

kyawzazaw 6y ago
Isn’t that issue that it is too expensive for companies to do what to have described due to volume?
- lampe3 6y ago
  which volume? volume if you need to hire a lot of people? volume of applicants?
shoo 6y ago
Possible failure modes with this approach: quite a few candidates who are not strong at actually doing the work will be able to somewhat convincingly "talk the talk" well enough to pass stage 2. If stage 3 is done async then there's a minority of candidates who will cheat and get someone else to solve the challenge for them. If the org has set up a hiring pipeline rather that first tries to identify strong hires before figuring out exactly which team they would join rather hiring to fill a specific role then step 2 might not make sense either, as there's no specific team to interview. I agree that the in person time pressured performative problem solving & coding engineering interview process is often a poor approximation of the work.
- crehn 6y ago
  Some companies (e.g. Amazon) have a separate verification interview to ensure the candidate is the author of the deliverable.
  - heavenlyblue 6y ago
    I think I failed one of the interviews this way actually: after having done the async part of it I did about 10 other test interviews and literally forgot about what I did for this one. I had quite a few “aha” moments where I was “ah wait, I totally didn’t do that, have I?”. Didn’t get the job, however neither did I like them.
- lampe3 6y ago
  Thats why you let people present the code and talk through it. We had one case were you could clearly see that the person had no clue what he is talking about it. Its quit easy to see. Just ask them to change something small.
- grumple 6y ago
  The problem you mention is why we have references, which you’re asked for when you apply to any job or use a recruiter (at least, a good one). Those references should be coworkers who can testify to their productivity, ability, and team fit. If at least two people who worked closely with someone like them enough to give a referral, they are probably worth hiring.

by lampe3 6y ago

kyawzazaw 6y ago

Isn’t that issue that it is too expensive for companies to do what to have described due to volume?

lampe3 6y ago
which volume? volume if you need to hire a lot of people? volume of applicants?

shoo 6y ago

Possible failure modes with this approach: quite a few candidates who are not strong at actually doing the work will be able to somewhat convincingly "talk the talk" well enough to pass stage 2. If stage 3 is done async then there's a minority of candidates who will cheat and get someone else to solve the challenge for them. If the org has set up a hiring pipeline rather that first tries to identify strong hires before figuring out exactly which team they would join rather hiring to fill a specific role then step 2 might not make sense either, as there's no specific team to interview. I agree that the in person time pressured performative problem solving & coding engineering interview process is often a poor approximation of the work.

crehn 6y ago
Some companies (e.g. Amazon) have a separate verification interview to ensure the candidate is the author of the deliverable.
- heavenlyblue 6y ago
  I think I failed one of the interviews this way actually: after having done the async part of it I did about 10 other test interviews and literally forgot about what I did for this one. I had quite a few “aha” moments where I was “ah wait, I totally didn’t do that, have I?”. Didn’t get the job, however neither did I like them.
lampe3 6y ago
Thats why you let people present the code and talk through it. We had one case were you could clearly see that the person had no clue what he is talking about it. Its quit easy to see. Just ask them to change something small.
grumple 6y ago
The problem you mention is why we have references, which you’re asked for when you apply to any job or use a recruiter (at least, a good one). Those references should be coworkers who can testify to their productivity, ability, and team fit. If at least two people who worked closely with someone like them enough to give a referral, they are probably worth hiring.