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My landlord installed a meth detector in my home which looks like a large smoke detector on the ceiling. It apparently communicates via the mobile network, but

My landlord installed a meth detector in my home which looks like a large smoke detector on the ceiling. It apparently communicates via the mobile network, but I have no idea how it actually measures meth. I doubt it actually measures anything (the product is made by http://www.methminder.co.nz/ http://www.methminder.co.nz/ but there is no actual information there). Point is, it makes tenants feel less secure. Which makes landlords feel more secure (ironically, products like these exploit the moral panic and lack of security that landlords feel regarding the meth crisis). Even if this Alexa for Landlords does nothing nefarious, its real purpose is to create that feeling of insecurity that landlords want. Maybe, just maybe, the landlord is listening. And we better not refuse the device because maybe they'll get the idea that we don't trust them...

dkdk8283 6y ago
Wow, first time I’ve seen something like this. The pricing model is a little expensive too. What’s next? Weed detectors? War on drugs seems to be pure profiteering.
- bergstromm466 6y ago
  I think Sex Detectors... don't want your tenant to have sex and leave stains on your furniture! Sex is for hotels! "If you wanted to have sex, you should've checked the tenancy agreement before you signed it." Edit: this was my attempt at a joke! it's satirical
  - smackay 6y ago
    There is considerable scope for universities or any other organisation to ensure that assaults or even unwanted consensual activities are not taking place on their property. This raises the interesting question - now prevention is more practical and thus enforceable are we likely to see a tightening of behavioural standards and social norms either because the technology allows it or because that's the easiest way to avoid the technology. In either case it seems that a relaxed attitude to social behaviour may be on the way out.
    - bergstromm466 6y ago
      > There is considerable scope for universities or any other organisation to ensure that assaults or even unwanted consensual activities are not taking place on their property. woah i don't fully understand this or the [to you, interesting] question you posed, but I want to say that my post was satire... landlords (even university campuses) have no business meddling in 'unwanted consensual activities' as your naming suggests it is a 'consensual' activity, so there is no problem. being puritanical/prude about sex between young people is another thing. if American universities don't want people having sex in shared dorms with single-beds, then they could create European university style en-suite bedrooms that share a common area + kitchen... honestly American standards and customs scare the fuck out of me sometimes [1] [1] https://qz.com/1743640/us-abortion-politics-are-affecting-global-reproductive-health/ https://qz.com/1743640/us-abortion-politics-are-affecting-gl...
      - ISO-morphism 6y ago
        I believe gp was referring to places where sex is already forbidden by a property owner such as classrooms and offices, where if someone walks in on you having sex, you're the weird one because you shouldn't be having sex there, someone could walk in on you, there's no expectation of privacy. It's their property and they're paying you to be there temporarily to provide a service. > landlords (even university campuses) have no business meddling in 'unwanted consensual activities' Agreed, and I think GP would as well. Dorms are different. That's your domicile, the relationship with a university is that of a landlord/tenant. You're paying for a place to sleep and live. There's an expectation of privacy. If you walk into someone's dorm while they're having sex, why the hell are you barging into someone's room? That being said seeing a sex detector hanging from the ceiling would make me sad.
        deleted 6y ago
        [deleted]
    - rbecker 6y ago
      If you buy this logic for universities, then surely government has an even greater interest in ensuring assaults aren't taking place. So shall we mandate every private apartment has microphones installed, to catch terrorists and child molesters, and stop the spread of hateful ideologies? Or perhaps we want to limit activities that apartments weren't licensed for, like working from home, babysitting, exercise, more than 3 guests at a time, alcohol consumption... activities forbidden by the rental agreement unless you pay extra. By letting you pay a lower rent if you don't need those activities, landlords can pass the savings on to you, the consumer! You wouldn't want to forbid such practices and force higher prices on renters who don't need those perks, would you? The above is satire for now, but it'll happen if we let it, guaranteed.
- treis 6y ago
  Meth contaimination is a huge problem and can be very costly to remediate. It's mostly from cooking meth but even using can contaiminate a house causing 6 figures in damages.
  - bzb5 6y ago
    More info about this: https://www.google.de/amp/s/arstechnica.com/science/2019/10/meth-traces-linger-in-homes-used-for-cooking-much-longer-than-expected/%3famp=1 https://www.google.de/amp/s/arstechnica.com/science/2019/10/... — sounds pretty bad.
  - zxcmx 6y ago
    Re: contamination from use: If you look into it, you'll find the "contamination" is that with a sensitive enough test, you can tell it's there. The six figures in damages tend to be self-inflicted. The NZ government spent hundreds of millions on "meth house" remediation that by any rational analysis didn't need to be done. https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/104287037/rental-meth-panic-over https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/104287037/rental-met... Agree that manufacture is a totally different story.
    - treis 6y ago
      Sure maybe the standards are too stringent but that's cold comfort to the landlord that has to meet them. They're still out the money whether or not it was actually necessary.
  - grugagag 6y ago
    What kind of contamination are we talking about here? Does it enter the walls and the smell is hard to get rid of?
    - treis 6y ago
      It gets aerosolized and then eventually settles on every surface of the house. The residue can be washed off sometimes. If not you need to take everything down to the studs and put new drywall & flooring in.
- nitrogen 6y ago
  I wish my previous SF apartment had obnoxious chemical detectors. Smells and smokes and chemicals don't just stay in one apartment, and the management couldn't track down their source, despite being strong enough to cause health problems for others. The war on drugs is total BS, but so is trashing a place and sickening neighbors just for your own selfish high. There are ways to do things that are respectful of others.
vharuck 6y ago
>Q What does Meth Minder cost per month? A Monitoring starts at $49.95 per month. ($11.53 per week) See full pricing here. All prices include gst I appreciate the poetics of a rent-seeking company targeting landlords.
- codetrotter 6y ago
  Yeah but the landlords are just gonna pile this costs onto their tenants, aren’t they? So in the end the tenants are the ones paying for it, not the landlords.
  - bananaface 6y ago
    If a landlord tried to charge me $50 a month for a meth detector, I'd move. A very small fraction of this is going to be passed on to tenants.
    - jagged-chisel 6y ago
      It’ll be added to your lease. They don’t break out your rent payment into “sidewalks, hallways, carpet, walls, sink, faucet, fixtures...” but those costs are there. They’ll bury meth detection in the rent payment, and that’s that.
      - bananaface 6y ago
        Then their apartment would be $50/month over the competition, so I wouldn't move there. If they could charge that, they'd already be doing it. You can't just "offload costs," it's not how pricing works.
        cynicalkane 6y ago
        This is correct. If some given set of landlords can get away with charging $50 more per month, they'd already be doing it. Some individual landlords might be irrational, but as a whole property isn't a market where people leave money on the table.
owenwil 6y ago
Wow, this is the most New Zealand landlord thing ever. I bet they've installed the Meth Minder but don't provide proper heating still.
- nogabebop23 6y ago
  can't you heat your apartment with the residual from cooking meth?
atoav 6y ago
This is why you want to have laws protecting the privacy of one's home: landlords shouldn't even have the choice to do this.
dylan604 6y ago
Meth Detector, Ha! Meth heads will just place a ziplock bag with a rubber band around just like all of the weed smokers in hotels. Never underestimate the "creativity" of a tweaker.
- apexalpha 6y ago
  Perhaps this is more to prevent the place from becoming a meth lab rather than a place where one smokes meth. Can't say I've ever smelled it. Is it very distinct?
  - dylan604 6y ago
    The point still remains, a tweaker will always find a way. If the plastic bag over the detector is enough to block the smoker's fumes, why would a tweaker not think it would be good enough to block a lab's? Again, we're talking about tweakers. They can come up with crazy ideas, but it doesn't mean they are good ones.
    - apexalpha 6y ago
      Perhaps the detector can detect if air isn't circulating around it anymore, no idea.
Threeve303 6y ago
Look on the bright side, if you ever decide to buy math you have a good way to find out if it’s the real thing.
thatfrenchguy 6y ago
By local law you can probably take it off and put it back when you’re gone.

dkdk8283 6y ago

Wow, first time I’ve seen something like this. The pricing model is a little expensive too. What’s next? Weed detectors? War on drugs seems to be pure profiteering.

bergstromm466 6y ago
I think Sex Detectors... don't want your tenant to have sex and leave stains on your furniture! Sex is for hotels! "If you wanted to have sex, you should've checked the tenancy agreement before you signed it." Edit: this was my attempt at a joke! it's satirical
- smackay 6y ago
  There is considerable scope for universities or any other organisation to ensure that assaults or even unwanted consensual activities are not taking place on their property. This raises the interesting question - now prevention is more practical and thus enforceable are we likely to see a tightening of behavioural standards and social norms either because the technology allows it or because that's the easiest way to avoid the technology. In either case it seems that a relaxed attitude to social behaviour may be on the way out.
  - bergstromm466 6y ago
    > There is considerable scope for universities or any other organisation to ensure that assaults or even unwanted consensual activities are not taking place on their property. woah i don't fully understand this or the [to you, interesting] question you posed, but I want to say that my post was satire... landlords (even university campuses) have no business meddling in 'unwanted consensual activities' as your naming suggests it is a 'consensual' activity, so there is no problem. being puritanical/prude about sex between young people is another thing. if American universities don't want people having sex in shared dorms with single-beds, then they could create European university style en-suite bedrooms that share a common area + kitchen... honestly American standards and customs scare the fuck out of me sometimes [1] [1] https://qz.com/1743640/us-abortion-politics-are-affecting-global-reproductive-health/ https://qz.com/1743640/us-abortion-politics-are-affecting-gl...
    - ISO-morphism 6y ago
      I believe gp was referring to places where sex is already forbidden by a property owner such as classrooms and offices, where if someone walks in on you having sex, you're the weird one because you shouldn't be having sex there, someone could walk in on you, there's no expectation of privacy. It's their property and they're paying you to be there temporarily to provide a service. > landlords (even university campuses) have no business meddling in 'unwanted consensual activities' Agreed, and I think GP would as well. Dorms are different. That's your domicile, the relationship with a university is that of a landlord/tenant. You're paying for a place to sleep and live. There's an expectation of privacy. If you walk into someone's dorm while they're having sex, why the hell are you barging into someone's room? That being said seeing a sex detector hanging from the ceiling would make me sad.
      - deleted 6y ago
        [deleted]
  - rbecker 6y ago
    If you buy this logic for universities, then surely government has an even greater interest in ensuring assaults aren't taking place. So shall we mandate every private apartment has microphones installed, to catch terrorists and child molesters, and stop the spread of hateful ideologies? Or perhaps we want to limit activities that apartments weren't licensed for, like working from home, babysitting, exercise, more than 3 guests at a time, alcohol consumption... activities forbidden by the rental agreement unless you pay extra. By letting you pay a lower rent if you don't need those activities, landlords can pass the savings on to you, the consumer! You wouldn't want to forbid such practices and force higher prices on renters who don't need those perks, would you? The above is satire for now, but it'll happen if we let it, guaranteed.
treis 6y ago
Meth contaimination is a huge problem and can be very costly to remediate. It's mostly from cooking meth but even using can contaiminate a house causing 6 figures in damages.
- bzb5 6y ago
  More info about this: https://www.google.de/amp/s/arstechnica.com/science/2019/10/meth-traces-linger-in-homes-used-for-cooking-much-longer-than-expected/%3famp=1 https://www.google.de/amp/s/arstechnica.com/science/2019/10/... — sounds pretty bad.
- zxcmx 6y ago
  Re: contamination from use: If you look into it, you'll find the "contamination" is that with a sensitive enough test, you can tell it's there. The six figures in damages tend to be self-inflicted. The NZ government spent hundreds of millions on "meth house" remediation that by any rational analysis didn't need to be done. https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/104287037/rental-meth-panic-over https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/104287037/rental-met... Agree that manufacture is a totally different story.
  - treis 6y ago
    Sure maybe the standards are too stringent but that's cold comfort to the landlord that has to meet them. They're still out the money whether or not it was actually necessary.
- grugagag 6y ago
  What kind of contamination are we talking about here? Does it enter the walls and the smell is hard to get rid of?
  - treis 6y ago
    It gets aerosolized and then eventually settles on every surface of the house. The residue can be washed off sometimes. If not you need to take everything down to the studs and put new drywall & flooring in.
nitrogen 6y ago
I wish my previous SF apartment had obnoxious chemical detectors. Smells and smokes and chemicals don't just stay in one apartment, and the management couldn't track down their source, despite being strong enough to cause health problems for others. The war on drugs is total BS, but so is trashing a place and sickening neighbors just for your own selfish high. There are ways to do things that are respectful of others.

vharuck 6y ago

>Q What does Meth Minder cost per month? A Monitoring starts at $49.95 per month. ($11.53 per week) See full pricing here. All prices include gst I appreciate the poetics of a rent-seeking company targeting landlords.

codetrotter 6y ago
Yeah but the landlords are just gonna pile this costs onto their tenants, aren’t they? So in the end the tenants are the ones paying for it, not the landlords.
- bananaface 6y ago
  If a landlord tried to charge me $50 a month for a meth detector, I'd move. A very small fraction of this is going to be passed on to tenants.
  - jagged-chisel 6y ago
    It’ll be added to your lease. They don’t break out your rent payment into “sidewalks, hallways, carpet, walls, sink, faucet, fixtures...” but those costs are there. They’ll bury meth detection in the rent payment, and that’s that.
    - bananaface 6y ago
      Then their apartment would be $50/month over the competition, so I wouldn't move there. If they could charge that, they'd already be doing it. You can't just "offload costs," it's not how pricing works.
      - cynicalkane 6y ago
        This is correct. If some given set of landlords can get away with charging $50 more per month, they'd already be doing it. Some individual landlords might be irrational, but as a whole property isn't a market where people leave money on the table.

owenwil 6y ago

Wow, this is the most New Zealand landlord thing ever. I bet they've installed the Meth Minder but don't provide proper heating still.

nogabebop23 6y ago
can't you heat your apartment with the residual from cooking meth?

atoav 6y ago

This is why you want to have laws protecting the privacy of one's home: landlords shouldn't even have the choice to do this.

dylan604 6y ago

Meth Detector, Ha! Meth heads will just place a ziplock bag with a rubber band around just like all of the weed smokers in hotels. Never underestimate the "creativity" of a tweaker.

apexalpha 6y ago
Perhaps this is more to prevent the place from becoming a meth lab rather than a place where one smokes meth. Can't say I've ever smelled it. Is it very distinct?
- dylan604 6y ago
  The point still remains, a tweaker will always find a way. If the plastic bag over the detector is enough to block the smoker's fumes, why would a tweaker not think it would be good enough to block a lab's? Again, we're talking about tweakers. They can come up with crazy ideas, but it doesn't mean they are good ones.
  - apexalpha 6y ago
    Perhaps the detector can detect if air isn't circulating around it anymore, no idea.

Threeve303 6y ago

Look on the bright side, if you ever decide to buy math you have a good way to find out if it’s the real thing.

thatfrenchguy 6y ago

By local law you can probably take it off and put it back when you’re gone.