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If you managed to finish the app, you weren't very depressed. Depression acts primarily on willpower. The bad feelings come as a consequence of not being able

If you managed to finish the app, you weren't very depressed. Depression acts primarily on willpower. The bad feelings come as a consequence of not being able to get anything done.

ElvisTrout 6y ago
That’s rather presumptive.
jdsalaro 6y ago
> If you managed to finish the app, you weren't very depressed. I disagree, as someone with experience in the matter. I think is fine to question whether OP's depression was a real major depressive episode or to what extent they were really depressed. However, the succinctness of your comment leads me to believe that it's more simplistic than anything and thus counterproductive while discussing depression. It's not always a matter of "but was it real depression, though?" > Depression acts primarily on willpower. Depression acts on everything and shouldn't be characterized so easily. That's exactly what happens in real life, where a statement like yours can instantly nullify the efforts of someone trying to tell you that, yes, they look normal, but something is wrong. To that, you'd likely reply, "but Jane, you don't look that depressed!" Some people are able to keep operating on certain realms, which IMHO is the key to getting out of the rut; grasping whatever still motivates you, even if just a bit, to operate at 1% of your normal capacity and "power" on. > The bad feelings come as a consequence of not being able to get anything done. I repeat, not always and not for everyone as the causes for circumstantial and clinical depression are too many to count and so are the symptoms and the way they are externalized.
- GordonS 6y ago
  > Depression acts on everything and shouldn't be characterized so easily ^^ This. I've battled with depression since I was something like 7-10 years old, and it's just not as simple as the GP implies. Depression affects different people to different degrees, and has different impacts - human beings are afterall very complex beasts. Being depressed also doesn't necessarily mean that you feel that low all the time - or at least that those feelings aren't in the foreground. Some days, weeks or months are worse that others. It's absolutely always there, but sometimes I can have a streak of weeks where I feel like I'm winning, and it's only in the background. I'd also add that people with depression cn be very good at hiding it, to the point where they can even be hiding it from themselves. Barring occasional random on the internet, like now, I haven't told a single real person about it for the 30-year (and counting term) of my depression. Despite growing up with a parent with manic depression, somehow I didn't even recognise the way I felt as depression until I was in my 20's.
  - NalNezumi 6y ago
    Just curious, how did you find out that you were hiding your depression from yourself? (I assume you wrote from personal experience) Especially when other people tell you that they think you have depression?
    - GordonS 6y ago
      Yes, I'm writing from personal experience. I'm pushing 40, and I've felt this way since I was a young kid. I think because it started so early, it was just the way things had always been. Probably as a kid I didn't have the emotional maturity to recognise what was happening either. Nobody has ever told me they think I have depression - I'm very good at hiding it. My main coping mechanism, if you can call it that, was to bury my head in the sand and pretend everything was fine. As for how I found out, it was very slowly, over a period of a few years, as I matured into an adult. Looking back I can see that my mental state deteriorated, likely due to stress caused by various life events and (physical) health issues, and everything kind of came to a head. At some point I couldn't bury my head in the sand and ignore it anymore and think "it's just me, I'm weird". But even once deep down I recognised it as "depression", it was a long time before I'd even say in my head "I have depression". This was 15-20 years ago, and there was even more stigma around mental health then than there is now, and my shame was probably tempered by how one of my parents (with manic depression) had been viewed while I grew up. I also felt guilty - I had a wife, house, job, plenty of disposable income etc; how could I still feel like this when my life seemed so superficially perfect? Even though I admit it to myself now, I doubt I'll ever tell anyone else, even my wife. Would anyone even believe me, believe that it was possible to hide such a thing my entire life? But now I'm rambling, I'll end it there :)
      - NalNezumi 6y ago
        No thank you for your rambling, it is for me (in my late 20's) an anecdote most valuable. I asked because I don't consider myself remotely close to it, having good job (well until today my last day) and a good safety net. But in the past few days, my SO & a friend have told me that I should maybe seek therapy. My first instinct is to dismiss is and focus my time on betterment of myself through other means, but your anecdote made me think of the possibility that I might just be oblivious about it. Unfortunately I live in a country where mental health is still a stigma and my insurance is gone with the work, but your experience at least nudge me towards trying to seek out professionals for it. (when I one day return to my homecountry where it isn't a stigma)
genericone 6y ago
I didn't think someone could apply 'no true scotsman' to something so broad as depression.
hooo 6y ago
> If you managed to finish the app, you weren't very depressed. Well it sounds like the app fixed their depression then!
nxpnsv 6y ago
Like many conditions depression expresses it self in diverse ways. It certainly is not the same for everyone. Furthermore, you should avoid diagnosing the severity of psychological conditions by reading their blog posts.
- tuatoru 6y ago
  I couldn't read the blog post. I was summarising my own experience (20 years and counting), that of people I have observed with diagnoses of depression, and my reading in the subject.
  - nxpnsv 6y ago
    I don't think your observation is off in general. But applied to a particular person to judge their condition it is not helpful. More so when we don't know circumstances of the depressed developer.
cgriswald 6y ago
When I was (very) depressed I could get plenty done. I just couldn’t feel any reward for getting anything done. Of course, I couldn’t feel any reward for slacking off either. So I had the choice to either live in a world of ash or live in a world of ash and do something. Either way I felt (or more accurately didn’t feel) the same way. So it was an easy choice and no willpower was required to actually do stuff.
- searchableguy 6y ago
  That's important to learn. When given the choice to feel nothing about either, you should choose something productive to do. People are much more likely to help you if you have a good past record and can maintain some benefits for them. It's an investment to help a depressed person for society and if you get stuck in the hole for longer, you are that unlikely to get any help.
  - kyanne 6y ago
    This is an incredibly callous and sad way to think of the well-being of other human beings. Helping another person as they struggle with their mental health shouldn't be an investment, something you expect to extract value from later; you help someone through difficult times because you care about them and love them. It's something you should do out of the goodness of your heart. Viewing all of your relationships as investments is selfish, hurtful, and will very likely result in a very lonely life for you
    - searchableguy 6y ago
      I don't. It's an observation.
bildung 6y ago
This isn't necessarily true, depression can have quite different faces. ICD-10 differentiates between * major depressions with a single episode (F32 - this is probably what you had in mind) * recurrent episodes of various degrees (F33 - this includes seasonal affective disorders, i.e. recurring winter blues) * Persistant mood disorders like dysthymia, where your baseline mood is dysphoric (F34.1)
ColeyG 6y ago
Are you a doctor?

If you managed to finish the app, you weren't very depressed. Depression acts primarily on willpower. The bad feelings come as a consequence of not being able to get anything done.

ElvisTrout 6y ago

That’s rather presumptive.

jdsalaro 6y ago

> If you managed to finish the app, you weren't very depressed. I disagree, as someone with experience in the matter. I think is fine to question whether OP's depression was a real major depressive episode or to what extent they were really depressed. However, the succinctness of your comment leads me to believe that it's more simplistic than anything and thus counterproductive while discussing depression. It's not always a matter of "but was it real depression, though?" > Depression acts primarily on willpower. Depression acts on everything and shouldn't be characterized so easily. That's exactly what happens in real life, where a statement like yours can instantly nullify the efforts of someone trying to tell you that, yes, they look normal, but something is wrong. To that, you'd likely reply, "but Jane, you don't look that depressed!" Some people are able to keep operating on certain realms, which IMHO is the key to getting out of the rut; grasping whatever still motivates you, even if just a bit, to operate at 1% of your normal capacity and "power" on. > The bad feelings come as a consequence of not being able to get anything done. I repeat, not always and not for everyone as the causes for circumstantial and clinical depression are too many to count and so are the symptoms and the way they are externalized.

GordonS 6y ago
> Depression acts on everything and shouldn't be characterized so easily ^^ This. I've battled with depression since I was something like 7-10 years old, and it's just not as simple as the GP implies. Depression affects different people to different degrees, and has different impacts - human beings are afterall very complex beasts. Being depressed also doesn't necessarily mean that you feel that low all the time - or at least that those feelings aren't in the foreground. Some days, weeks or months are worse that others. It's absolutely always there, but sometimes I can have a streak of weeks where I feel like I'm winning, and it's only in the background. I'd also add that people with depression cn be very good at hiding it, to the point where they can even be hiding it from themselves. Barring occasional random on the internet, like now, I haven't told a single real person about it for the 30-year (and counting term) of my depression. Despite growing up with a parent with manic depression, somehow I didn't even recognise the way I felt as depression until I was in my 20's.
- NalNezumi 6y ago
  Just curious, how did you find out that you were hiding your depression from yourself? (I assume you wrote from personal experience) Especially when other people tell you that they think you have depression?
  - GordonS 6y ago
    Yes, I'm writing from personal experience. I'm pushing 40, and I've felt this way since I was a young kid. I think because it started so early, it was just the way things had always been. Probably as a kid I didn't have the emotional maturity to recognise what was happening either. Nobody has ever told me they think I have depression - I'm very good at hiding it. My main coping mechanism, if you can call it that, was to bury my head in the sand and pretend everything was fine. As for how I found out, it was very slowly, over a period of a few years, as I matured into an adult. Looking back I can see that my mental state deteriorated, likely due to stress caused by various life events and (physical) health issues, and everything kind of came to a head. At some point I couldn't bury my head in the sand and ignore it anymore and think "it's just me, I'm weird". But even once deep down I recognised it as "depression", it was a long time before I'd even say in my head "I have depression". This was 15-20 years ago, and there was even more stigma around mental health then than there is now, and my shame was probably tempered by how one of my parents (with manic depression) had been viewed while I grew up. I also felt guilty - I had a wife, house, job, plenty of disposable income etc; how could I still feel like this when my life seemed so superficially perfect? Even though I admit it to myself now, I doubt I'll ever tell anyone else, even my wife. Would anyone even believe me, believe that it was possible to hide such a thing my entire life? But now I'm rambling, I'll end it there :)
    - NalNezumi 6y ago
      No thank you for your rambling, it is for me (in my late 20's) an anecdote most valuable. I asked because I don't consider myself remotely close to it, having good job (well until today my last day) and a good safety net. But in the past few days, my SO & a friend have told me that I should maybe seek therapy. My first instinct is to dismiss is and focus my time on betterment of myself through other means, but your anecdote made me think of the possibility that I might just be oblivious about it. Unfortunately I live in a country where mental health is still a stigma and my insurance is gone with the work, but your experience at least nudge me towards trying to seek out professionals for it. (when I one day return to my homecountry where it isn't a stigma)

genericone 6y ago

I didn't think someone could apply 'no true scotsman' to something so broad as depression.

hooo 6y ago

> If you managed to finish the app, you weren't very depressed. Well it sounds like the app fixed their depression then!

nxpnsv 6y ago

Like many conditions depression expresses it self in diverse ways. It certainly is not the same for everyone. Furthermore, you should avoid diagnosing the severity of psychological conditions by reading their blog posts.

tuatoru 6y ago
I couldn't read the blog post. I was summarising my own experience (20 years and counting), that of people I have observed with diagnoses of depression, and my reading in the subject.
- nxpnsv 6y ago
  I don't think your observation is off in general. But applied to a particular person to judge their condition it is not helpful. More so when we don't know circumstances of the depressed developer.

cgriswald 6y ago

When I was (very) depressed I could get plenty done. I just couldn’t feel any reward for getting anything done. Of course, I couldn’t feel any reward for slacking off either. So I had the choice to either live in a world of ash or live in a world of ash and do something. Either way I felt (or more accurately didn’t feel) the same way. So it was an easy choice and no willpower was required to actually do stuff.

searchableguy 6y ago
That's important to learn. When given the choice to feel nothing about either, you should choose something productive to do. People are much more likely to help you if you have a good past record and can maintain some benefits for them. It's an investment to help a depressed person for society and if you get stuck in the hole for longer, you are that unlikely to get any help.
- kyanne 6y ago
  This is an incredibly callous and sad way to think of the well-being of other human beings. Helping another person as they struggle with their mental health shouldn't be an investment, something you expect to extract value from later; you help someone through difficult times because you care about them and love them. It's something you should do out of the goodness of your heart. Viewing all of your relationships as investments is selfish, hurtful, and will very likely result in a very lonely life for you
  - searchableguy 6y ago
    I don't. It's an observation.

bildung 6y ago

This isn't necessarily true, depression can have quite different faces. ICD-10 differentiates between * major depressions with a single episode (F32 - this is probably what you had in mind) * recurrent episodes of various degrees (F33 - this includes seasonal affective disorders, i.e. recurring winter blues) * Persistant mood disorders like dysthymia, where your baseline mood is dysphoric (F34.1)

ColeyG 6y ago

Are you a doctor?