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All products even with ownership come with rules and regulations. Houses can’t be arbitrarily changed. Cars have governors. Scissors shouldn’t be run with. Ow

All products even with ownership come with rules and regulations. Houses can’t be arbitrarily changed. Cars have governors. Scissors shouldn’t be run with. Ownership of an iPhone is not different. It just has special rules attached. If you don’t mind breaking the warranty, please jailbreak your iPhone and install whatever apps you’d prefer.

kalleboo 6y ago
> Houses can’t be arbitrarily changed. Cars have governors. Scissors shouldn’t be run with. None of these regulations are decided by the company that manufactured the device, they are all decided democratically by an elected state. How about... Houses can't have arbitrary appliances installed that weren't made by someone approved by the house-builder Cars can't fill up gas from a stand not paying 30% by the car manufacturer Scissors can't cut paper sold by someone unaffiliated by the scissor manufacturer. Sounds reasonable to me! > If you don’t mind breaking the warranty, please jailbreak your iPhone and install whatever apps you’d prefer. No, Apple wanted jailbreaking to be "go to jail" illegal, not just voiding your warranty.
- yazaddaruvala 6y ago
  Maybe I should have clarified. The Strata/HOA regulates the appliances, the customizations, even the “look and feel” of my patio.
- dylan-m 6y ago
  > Scissors can't cut paper sold by someone unaffiliated by the scissor manufacturer. Of course, going by evidence in these threads, people would defend Scissors Corp to the death, arguing "but that's a feature which makes these scissors safe so people don't injure themselves, and sure they own half of the scissors (and paper) market but you can always bring your own scissors (and paper) and avoid interacting with people who use Scissors Corp stuff, so what's the problem?"
  - yazaddaruvala 6y ago
    If I bought scissors that could only cut certain types of paper, thickness or proprietary paper, I wouldn’t later complain about their inability to cut all paper. “Ownership” of a tool has always been limited to the feature set the manufacturer originally intended for it. This entitlement over the tools Apple creates, accurately advertises, and legal sells is the only problem I see. [1] https://www.sliceproducts.com/safety-scissors https://www.sliceproducts.com/safety-scissors
    - stale2002 6y ago
      > If I bought scissors that could only cut certain types of paper If there was a scissors duopoly, in which a company that controls 50% of the market, implemented practices that are anti-competitive, then this could be illegal. > has always been limited to the feature set the manufacturer originally intended for it. Actually, no. Once you purchased the item, you can do whatever you want with it, regardless of what the manufacture wants. > This entitlement This is about anti-trust law. Apple should follow the law. They are not entitled to break the law, without consequences.
      - yazaddaruvala 6y ago
        And the courts agreed! I agree! If you want to jailbreak your iPhone you can and you should! I even agree Apple should be forced to create more tools to create jailbroken iPhones. However, the warranty should be void. Same as if you use scissors as a hammer, which is your right, the warranty is void. Expecting the original warranty to hold, or expecting the manufacturer to help you misuse the tool is the entitlement.
        stale2002 6y ago
        > expecting the manufacturer to help If their actions are anti-competitive, then they absolutely have obligations, under anti-trust law, which does not require a literal monopoly, and only instead requires significant market power for these laws to apply. Apple is subject to the law. They have to follow it, or they will suffer consequences.
stale2002 6y ago
The US courts have consistently held that it is perfectly legal to do anything to your privated owned things that are not public. Your house example is wrong, because that has public viewing concerns on a plot of land. And your car example is incorrect. I could make any changes at all to a car, that is not put on public roads. That has nothing to do with the manufacturer putting restrictions on your car.
- yazaddaruvala 6y ago
  iPhones are put on “public” internet and therefore is restricted for the safety of the user and the safety of society. If you want to cherry pick arguments we can do this all day. The reality is Apple is just doing what every manufacturer has done for millennia!
  - stale2002 6y ago
    > The reality is Apple is just doing what every manufacturer has done for millennia! Certain actions are illegal if a company has too much market power. Anti trust law does not require a literal, singular monopoly, in order for some anti-competitive behaviors to be illegal. Instead, Apple has ~50% of the market share in the US, and that is within the realm where certain actions become illegal, according to anti-trust law.
- MichaelZuo 6y ago
  This is false, modern cars contain equipment capable of transmitting EM waves and thus regulated by the FCC and equivalent agencies in most other countries. These regulations apply even on private property. You can not arbitrarily change that legally. The same applies to all private houses, installing in a home a powerful transmitter to broadcast noise is certainly illegal without approval.

kalleboo 6y ago

> Houses can’t be arbitrarily changed. Cars have governors. Scissors shouldn’t be run with. None of these regulations are decided by the company that manufactured the device, they are all decided democratically by an elected state. How about... Houses can't have arbitrary appliances installed that weren't made by someone approved by the house-builder Cars can't fill up gas from a stand not paying 30% by the car manufacturer Scissors can't cut paper sold by someone unaffiliated by the scissor manufacturer. Sounds reasonable to me! > If you don’t mind breaking the warranty, please jailbreak your iPhone and install whatever apps you’d prefer. No, Apple wanted jailbreaking to be "go to jail" illegal, not just voiding your warranty.

yazaddaruvala 6y ago
Maybe I should have clarified. The Strata/HOA regulates the appliances, the customizations, even the “look and feel” of my patio.
dylan-m 6y ago
> Scissors can't cut paper sold by someone unaffiliated by the scissor manufacturer. Of course, going by evidence in these threads, people would defend Scissors Corp to the death, arguing "but that's a feature which makes these scissors safe so people don't injure themselves, and sure they own half of the scissors (and paper) market but you can always bring your own scissors (and paper) and avoid interacting with people who use Scissors Corp stuff, so what's the problem?"
- yazaddaruvala 6y ago
  If I bought scissors that could only cut certain types of paper, thickness or proprietary paper, I wouldn’t later complain about their inability to cut all paper. “Ownership” of a tool has always been limited to the feature set the manufacturer originally intended for it. This entitlement over the tools Apple creates, accurately advertises, and legal sells is the only problem I see. [1] https://www.sliceproducts.com/safety-scissors https://www.sliceproducts.com/safety-scissors
  - stale2002 6y ago
    > If I bought scissors that could only cut certain types of paper If there was a scissors duopoly, in which a company that controls 50% of the market, implemented practices that are anti-competitive, then this could be illegal. > has always been limited to the feature set the manufacturer originally intended for it. Actually, no. Once you purchased the item, you can do whatever you want with it, regardless of what the manufacture wants. > This entitlement This is about anti-trust law. Apple should follow the law. They are not entitled to break the law, without consequences.
    - yazaddaruvala 6y ago
      And the courts agreed! I agree! If you want to jailbreak your iPhone you can and you should! I even agree Apple should be forced to create more tools to create jailbroken iPhones. However, the warranty should be void. Same as if you use scissors as a hammer, which is your right, the warranty is void. Expecting the original warranty to hold, or expecting the manufacturer to help you misuse the tool is the entitlement.
      - stale2002 6y ago
        > expecting the manufacturer to help If their actions are anti-competitive, then they absolutely have obligations, under anti-trust law, which does not require a literal monopoly, and only instead requires significant market power for these laws to apply. Apple is subject to the law. They have to follow it, or they will suffer consequences.

stale2002 6y ago

The US courts have consistently held that it is perfectly legal to do anything to your privated owned things that are not public. Your house example is wrong, because that has public viewing concerns on a plot of land. And your car example is incorrect. I could make any changes at all to a car, that is not put on public roads. That has nothing to do with the manufacturer putting restrictions on your car.

yazaddaruvala 6y ago
iPhones are put on “public” internet and therefore is restricted for the safety of the user and the safety of society. If you want to cherry pick arguments we can do this all day. The reality is Apple is just doing what every manufacturer has done for millennia!
- stale2002 6y ago
  > The reality is Apple is just doing what every manufacturer has done for millennia! Certain actions are illegal if a company has too much market power. Anti trust law does not require a literal, singular monopoly, in order for some anti-competitive behaviors to be illegal. Instead, Apple has ~50% of the market share in the US, and that is within the realm where certain actions become illegal, according to anti-trust law.
MichaelZuo 6y ago
This is false, modern cars contain equipment capable of transmitting EM waves and thus regulated by the FCC and equivalent agencies in most other countries. These regulations apply even on private property. You can not arbitrarily change that legally. The same applies to all private houses, installing in a home a powerful transmitter to broadcast noise is certainly illegal without approval.