4 ms·

I got curious and listened to it, and after listening to that load of rubbish, I simply don't feel connected with society anymore. Do people actually listen to

I got curious and listened to it, and after listening to that load of rubbish, I simply don't feel connected with society anymore. Do people actually listen to this and like it, or is it just the perceived shock value that counts?

geraltofrivia 6y ago
WAP specifically feels like an experiment. A female singer's equivalent to the overtly sexual hiphop. In music, and in video. Anecdotal: Friends have acknowledged that they're more disgusted by it than the male singer's counterparts. I admit I am, too. And this is regardless of the particular singer's ability to sing/rap, or the lack thereof.
- Freak_NL 6y ago
  Interesting. What makes it more disgusting? Artistic merits aside, the (uncensored version of the) song and the music video seem justly regarded as a feminist redressing of the balance (if men can rap explicitly about being horny and wanting sex, so can women).
  - geraltofrivia 6y ago
    I recognise that, and thus acknowledge the importance of WAP, but I guess I'm more conditioned to expect this behaviour from men than from women? And the song makes me realise, and possibly correct for it, down the line.
- tomcam 6y ago
  Experiment? Little late for that. Nicki Minaj has been doing songs like this, better, for years
dredmorbius 6y ago
"Rock and roll" is an explicit reference to the sex act and "jazz" the usual male contribution to same. Mick Jagger couldn't "get no satisfaction", the Beatles asked "why don't we do it in the road", Nina Simone wanted "some sugar in my bowl", one-not-really-a-hit-wonder Hillary instructed listeners to "drop your pants around your ankles" (https://youtube.com/watch?v=Wu9Zps8vnEY https://youtube.com/watch?v=Wu9Zps8vnEY), and then there's pretty much everything about Barry White. WAP isn't the most nuanced contribution to this tradition, but it's hardly the first work exploiting the common-denominator. Its shock value largely lies in its novelty. In another 2-6 decades it will make the transition to familiar and then oldy. No predictions if it will be ranked with Simone, White, Jagger, the Beatles, or Hillary. Not my cuppa, though I got off the pop train a few decades back.
- 082349872349872 6y ago
  Also folk music[1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24130589 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24130589 (peasants with little to no agricultural surplus aren't interested in freemartins, neither four- nor two-legged. Compare "we also have a ‘big’ cycle of generations" in https://acoup.blog/2020/07/24/collections-bread-how-did-they-make-it-part-i-farmers/ https://acoup.blog/2020/07/24/collections-bread-how-did-they... ) I'm not intending to watch WAP until I must in order to understand a parody. There's certainly no shortage of other musical sublimation, such as the pin-up pastiche of https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpuemnGD-44 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpuemnGD-44 . Bonus clip (with gentlemen, it's "ladies first"): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDcixye_0Jo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDcixye_0Jo [1] is there any popular genre that lacks in innuendo? Those highly-censored soviets produced https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tDZl_wj8Fo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tDZl_wj8Fo , which raises a pose estimation question: how could the eponymous girl's tears possibly fall directly on such long spears? Was she standing on a ladder? Even the Taliban, I believe, allow arguably amorous lyrics, as long as (a) they're not accompanied by instrumentals, and (b) the surface meaning of "beloved" is the divine.
  - dredmorbius 6y ago
    The theme goes way back: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Song%20of%20Solomon%201&version=ESV https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Song%20of%20Sol... (By no means the earliest.)
    - 082349872349872 6y ago
      Hmm... Do not gaze at me because I am dark, because the sun has looked upon me. My mother's sons were angry with me; they made me keeper of the vineyards, suggests another layer to: Там смуглянка-молдаванка Собирала виноград. there's a dark-skinned moldavian girl harvesting the grapes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSc3fVBjYks https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSc3fVBjYks (The violinist's earrings don't contradict my white/red theory: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24382154 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24382154 )
circlefavshape 6y ago
I don't like the song much. It feels, as a straight guy, like a record label is manipulating me - using my sexuality as lever to increase their stream count. On the other hand - it's just bawdiness. Humorous role play. It's not as if it's a new invention
- goto11 6y ago
  > like a record label is manipulating me - using my sexuality as lever to increase their stream count. You mean the same way James Bond movies are "manipulating" you to buy tickets?
goto11 6y ago
Did you know the original version of "Tutti Frutti" (Little Richard, 1955) was about anal sex? ("If it don't fit, don't force it / You can grease it, make it easy") If you are appalled by that, fair enough. It is not something particularly new though. Of course people at the time also saw Rock'n'roll as bringing the end of civilized society. The furor caused by WAP is pretty hilarious to see.
- menybuvico 6y ago
  People have been making sexual references in song lyrics since the dawn of time, and that's perfectly fine. As mentioned in a sibling comment, it's not the explicit lyrics but the extremely low quality of the entire production that puts me off.
  - goto11 6y ago
    If so, can you articulate how it is "extremely low quality" compared to others songs in the same genre?
    - menybuvico 6y ago
      Too much profanities stuffed in, to such an extent that the desire to provoke takes up any space that could have been used for some kind of artistic expression. Or something. The track is simply a waste of time.
master-litty 6y ago
I think it's an insightful look at today's society, and I'm fond of it. It's a result of the ongoing sex pride and positivity movement in the US. Anecdotally, recent generations have been raised with sexual repression and frustration. The most obvious example is announcing yourself as gay and being very literally banished from your family household, but it is layered quite deeply -- I can go into detail, but in general, sex continues to be an unspoken and embarrassing topic that you figure out yourself in private. Since these urges are natural and part of the human experience, the whole treatment is odd and is often seen as uncaring. If you experience it, it puts you in an odd place: The repression forces you to either build a fiercely negative connection with sex, or develop a positive connection while having a struggled and inauthentic relationship with your family. There is a growingly open sentiment that it is healthy and natural to want to have sex, and to have it safely, and perhaps with multiple partners over the course of your life if it suits you, and perhaps with multiple partners at the same time if that suits you too, and to tell all your friends about what a great (or awful) time you had afterward. The novelty and "shock value" of this song, if you will, is being able to discuss these topics without consequence. And it reinforces something that is newly ingrained in society: To be more open and encouraging of safe sex for all is aligned with an active social movement that is making a difference to a lot of people, one that brings us closer to inner desires previously repressed. This song is especially fun for a few reasons but putting the silly absurdist humor aside, I see people get hooked because it strikes this social chord really hard, demonstrating this generation's cultural shift in a comically honest way. A progressive household has both partners happily and willfully cooking and cleaning regularly, so to be a more desirable partner there's pressure to offer something else extraordinary -- "I don't cook, I don't clean, but let me tell you how I got this ring". On a meta level, it's a comfortable beat for the bedroom and it sets a mood that is more primal. On another meta level, there's also a novelty that this song could only get to this level of popularity right now, realistically. It's not a song you can play on the radio or in stores.

geraltofrivia 6y ago

WAP specifically feels like an experiment. A female singer's equivalent to the overtly sexual hiphop. In music, and in video. Anecdotal: Friends have acknowledged that they're more disgusted by it than the male singer's counterparts. I admit I am, too. And this is regardless of the particular singer's ability to sing/rap, or the lack thereof.

Freak_NL 6y ago
Interesting. What makes it more disgusting? Artistic merits aside, the (uncensored version of the) song and the music video seem justly regarded as a feminist redressing of the balance (if men can rap explicitly about being horny and wanting sex, so can women).
- geraltofrivia 6y ago
  I recognise that, and thus acknowledge the importance of WAP, but I guess I'm more conditioned to expect this behaviour from men than from women? And the song makes me realise, and possibly correct for it, down the line.
tomcam 6y ago
Experiment? Little late for that. Nicki Minaj has been doing songs like this, better, for years

dredmorbius 6y ago

"Rock and roll" is an explicit reference to the sex act and "jazz" the usual male contribution to same. Mick Jagger couldn't "get no satisfaction", the Beatles asked "why don't we do it in the road", Nina Simone wanted "some sugar in my bowl", one-not-really-a-hit-wonder Hillary instructed listeners to "drop your pants around your ankles" (https://youtube.com/watch?v=Wu9Zps8vnEY https://youtube.com/watch?v=Wu9Zps8vnEY), and then there's pretty much everything about Barry White. WAP isn't the most nuanced contribution to this tradition, but it's hardly the first work exploiting the common-denominator. Its shock value largely lies in its novelty. In another 2-6 decades it will make the transition to familiar and then oldy. No predictions if it will be ranked with Simone, White, Jagger, the Beatles, or Hillary. Not my cuppa, though I got off the pop train a few decades back.

082349872349872 6y ago
Also folk music[1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24130589 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24130589 (peasants with little to no agricultural surplus aren't interested in freemartins, neither four- nor two-legged. Compare "we also have a ‘big’ cycle of generations" in https://acoup.blog/2020/07/24/collections-bread-how-did-they-make-it-part-i-farmers/ https://acoup.blog/2020/07/24/collections-bread-how-did-they... ) I'm not intending to watch WAP until I must in order to understand a parody. There's certainly no shortage of other musical sublimation, such as the pin-up pastiche of https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpuemnGD-44 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpuemnGD-44 . Bonus clip (with gentlemen, it's "ladies first"): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDcixye_0Jo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDcixye_0Jo [1] is there any popular genre that lacks in innuendo? Those highly-censored soviets produced https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tDZl_wj8Fo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tDZl_wj8Fo , which raises a pose estimation question: how could the eponymous girl's tears possibly fall directly on such long spears? Was she standing on a ladder? Even the Taliban, I believe, allow arguably amorous lyrics, as long as (a) they're not accompanied by instrumentals, and (b) the surface meaning of "beloved" is the divine.
- dredmorbius 6y ago
  The theme goes way back: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Song%20of%20Solomon%201&version=ESV https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Song%20of%20Sol... (By no means the earliest.)
  - 082349872349872 6y ago
    Hmm... Do not gaze at me because I am dark, because the sun has looked upon me. My mother's sons were angry with me; they made me keeper of the vineyards, suggests another layer to: Там смуглянка-молдаванка Собирала виноград. there's a dark-skinned moldavian girl harvesting the grapes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSc3fVBjYks https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSc3fVBjYks (The violinist's earrings don't contradict my white/red theory: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24382154 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24382154 )

circlefavshape 6y ago

I don't like the song much. It feels, as a straight guy, like a record label is manipulating me - using my sexuality as lever to increase their stream count. On the other hand - it's just bawdiness. Humorous role play. It's not as if it's a new invention

goto11 6y ago
> like a record label is manipulating me - using my sexuality as lever to increase their stream count. You mean the same way James Bond movies are "manipulating" you to buy tickets?

goto11 6y ago

Did you know the original version of "Tutti Frutti" (Little Richard, 1955) was about anal sex? ("If it don't fit, don't force it / You can grease it, make it easy") If you are appalled by that, fair enough. It is not something particularly new though. Of course people at the time also saw Rock'n'roll as bringing the end of civilized society. The furor caused by WAP is pretty hilarious to see.

menybuvico 6y ago
People have been making sexual references in song lyrics since the dawn of time, and that's perfectly fine. As mentioned in a sibling comment, it's not the explicit lyrics but the extremely low quality of the entire production that puts me off.
- goto11 6y ago
  If so, can you articulate how it is "extremely low quality" compared to others songs in the same genre?
  - menybuvico 6y ago
    Too much profanities stuffed in, to such an extent that the desire to provoke takes up any space that could have been used for some kind of artistic expression. Or something. The track is simply a waste of time.

master-litty 6y ago

I think it's an insightful look at today's society, and I'm fond of it. It's a result of the ongoing sex pride and positivity movement in the US. Anecdotally, recent generations have been raised with sexual repression and frustration. The most obvious example is announcing yourself as gay and being very literally banished from your family household, but it is layered quite deeply -- I can go into detail, but in general, sex continues to be an unspoken and embarrassing topic that you figure out yourself in private. Since these urges are natural and part of the human experience, the whole treatment is odd and is often seen as uncaring. If you experience it, it puts you in an odd place: The repression forces you to either build a fiercely negative connection with sex, or develop a positive connection while having a struggled and inauthentic relationship with your family. There is a growingly open sentiment that it is healthy and natural to want to have sex, and to have it safely, and perhaps with multiple partners over the course of your life if it suits you, and perhaps with multiple partners at the same time if that suits you too, and to tell all your friends about what a great (or awful) time you had afterward. The novelty and "shock value" of this song, if you will, is being able to discuss these topics without consequence. And it reinforces something that is newly ingrained in society: To be more open and encouraging of safe sex for all is aligned with an active social movement that is making a difference to a lot of people, one that brings us closer to inner desires previously repressed. This song is especially fun for a few reasons but putting the silly absurdist humor aside, I see people get hooked because it strikes this social chord really hard, demonstrating this generation's cultural shift in a comically honest way. A progressive household has both partners happily and willfully cooking and cleaning regularly, so to be a more desirable partner there's pressure to offer something else extraordinary -- "I don't cook, I don't clean, but let me tell you how I got this ring". On a meta level, it's a comfortable beat for the bedroom and it sets a mood that is more primal. On another meta level, there's also a novelty that this song could only get to this level of popularity right now, realistically. It's not a song you can play on the radio or in stores.