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It's simple: it is an abject failure as a currency. It is fairly successful as a security for the purpose of speculation. If you aren't a financial speculator,

It's simple: it is an abject failure as a currency. It is fairly successful as a security for the purpose of speculation. If you aren't a financial speculator, you really don't need to pay attention to it.

int_19h 6y ago
It's also fairly successful as a way to transfer money.
- hkt 6y ago
  And until recently, a highly successful way to _launder_ it.
  - meowface 6y ago
    Some other cryptocurrencies designed around anonymity are still very effective for that purpose. The only weaknesses are at the spots where the funds enter and exit the "laundry". (Converting to/from fiat or a less anonymous cryptocurrency.)
  - buzzdenver 6y ago
    Why did it stop being that?
    - d3nj4l 6y ago
      Because more secure cryptos, e.g. Monero, have picked up pace.
- perardi 6y ago
  I am pretty lucky that I only have to transfer money to between 2 countries that have heavily linked banking systems (US -> Canada), but I am not entirely sure what Bitcoin would get me in terms of transferring money. The fees are quite small on Transferwise, and also, I have…I don’t know what you want to call it…accountability? Reversibility? Reliability? Whatever fee I have to pay, the fact I get a known third-party with a papertrail is peace of mind.
  - captainmuon 6y ago
    Some time ago I had a bunch of Chinese yuan on a Chinese account that I wanted to transfer to Europe. I couldn't do a wire transfer, and I couldn't bring them as cash since my German bank didn't want them. I could either pull 500 € a day via ATM (with large fees), or just send it via Bitcoin.
    - riffraff 6y ago
      Why couldn't you do a wire transfer?
      - bmn__ 6y ago
        Before 2009, export of RMB was completely prohibited. Afterwards, some restrictions were lifted, but AIUI they do not apply to J. Random Laowai.
        Bayart 6y ago
        Nowadays, can people even have bank accounts in their names in China without Chinese ID ?
      - GoblinSlayer 6y ago
        Fiat financial systems are full of most arbitrary restrictions. My anecdote: I once wanted to deposit money, came to a bank, gave them a bank card, They: What is this? Me: Money. They: No, bring money.
  - Muromec 6y ago
    It’s great to live a in developed world during the peace time. Sometimes you have to transfer money in and out of the country at war with it’s currency in free fall and capital controls in place. At times like that “normal” ways take about 30% of the sum as transactional overhead, while bitcoin doesn’t. Sometimes “normal“ ways just don’t work normally. Sometimes your government is actively working against your ability to transfer your money for whatever reason — be it drug laws or capital controls or what not. Sometimes you enter account number into the “normal“ system and field just turns red for no reason at all. Sometimes you have your access to “normal“ system severely restricted because of your legal status and residency rights. So yeah transferring money between Canada and US being resident of either of them and not doing anything funny — is not a use case for Bitcoin.
- abpavel 6y ago
  However "transfer money" is a market need, and there are a number of companies that are doing that. I had to switch after I ran the costs of the service vs transaction fees of bitcoin. It's not much, but it adds up.
Shared404 6y ago
> it is an abject failure as a currency. In the US perhaps. In at least one other country however... https://www.bbc.com/news/business-47553048 https://www.bbc.com/news/business-47553048 https://www.somagnews.com/bitcoin-becomes-the-dominant-currency-in-venezuela/ https://www.somagnews.com/bitcoin-becomes-the-dominant-curre...
- riffraff 6y ago
  The second article makes a pretty strong claim but does not seem to have any proof other than "Venezuela uses crypto a lot", doesn't it?
wsc981 6y ago
I feel it's also a pretty decent store of value. Now some people will probably want to tell me that it's a bad store of value, since the value can fluctuate quite a bit on a day-to-day basis. Sure that true, but in the long run I am confident the value will only go up, whereas many fiat currencies will only go down, especially now due to QE (basically printing money) that's happening in Eurozone, the US, and many other regions [0][1] in the world as well. So in my view, it's pretty nice as an alternative to holding gold. Gold can be nice as well of course, but it's difficult to transport. If you keep gold in your home, at some point someone might break into your home and steal your gold. You could pay some company to store your gold, but perhaps in times of crises a government might step in and claim some of your gold. Crypto currencies can be easily held in a digital wallet or people can even just memorise the keys to their wallet in their brain. It's hard for governments to control crypto currencies and I'm sure some of the wealthiest people in the world now keep a certain small percentage of their wealth in cryptos as well as a hedge against fiat currencies, stock market crashes, etc... --- [0]: https://news.bitcoin.com/venezuela-bitcoin-use-hyperinflation-crypto-adoption/ https://news.bitcoin.com/venezuela-bitcoin-use-hyperinflatio... [1]: https://www.financemagnates.com/cryptocurrency/the-impact-of-inflation-on-crypto-adoption/ https://www.financemagnates.com/cryptocurrency/the-impact-of...

int_19h 6y ago

It's also fairly successful as a way to transfer money.

hkt 6y ago
And until recently, a highly successful way to _launder_ it.
- meowface 6y ago
  Some other cryptocurrencies designed around anonymity are still very effective for that purpose. The only weaknesses are at the spots where the funds enter and exit the "laundry". (Converting to/from fiat or a less anonymous cryptocurrency.)
- buzzdenver 6y ago
  Why did it stop being that?
  - d3nj4l 6y ago
    Because more secure cryptos, e.g. Monero, have picked up pace.
perardi 6y ago
I am pretty lucky that I only have to transfer money to between 2 countries that have heavily linked banking systems (US -> Canada), but I am not entirely sure what Bitcoin would get me in terms of transferring money. The fees are quite small on Transferwise, and also, I have…I don’t know what you want to call it…accountability? Reversibility? Reliability? Whatever fee I have to pay, the fact I get a known third-party with a papertrail is peace of mind.
- captainmuon 6y ago
  Some time ago I had a bunch of Chinese yuan on a Chinese account that I wanted to transfer to Europe. I couldn't do a wire transfer, and I couldn't bring them as cash since my German bank didn't want them. I could either pull 500 € a day via ATM (with large fees), or just send it via Bitcoin.
  - riffraff 6y ago
    Why couldn't you do a wire transfer?
    - bmn__ 6y ago
      Before 2009, export of RMB was completely prohibited. Afterwards, some restrictions were lifted, but AIUI they do not apply to J. Random Laowai.
      - Bayart 6y ago
        Nowadays, can people even have bank accounts in their names in China without Chinese ID ?
    - GoblinSlayer 6y ago
      Fiat financial systems are full of most arbitrary restrictions. My anecdote: I once wanted to deposit money, came to a bank, gave them a bank card, They: What is this? Me: Money. They: No, bring money.
- Muromec 6y ago
  It’s great to live a in developed world during the peace time. Sometimes you have to transfer money in and out of the country at war with it’s currency in free fall and capital controls in place. At times like that “normal” ways take about 30% of the sum as transactional overhead, while bitcoin doesn’t. Sometimes “normal“ ways just don’t work normally. Sometimes your government is actively working against your ability to transfer your money for whatever reason — be it drug laws or capital controls or what not. Sometimes you enter account number into the “normal“ system and field just turns red for no reason at all. Sometimes you have your access to “normal“ system severely restricted because of your legal status and residency rights. So yeah transferring money between Canada and US being resident of either of them and not doing anything funny — is not a use case for Bitcoin.
abpavel 6y ago
However "transfer money" is a market need, and there are a number of companies that are doing that. I had to switch after I ran the costs of the service vs transaction fees of bitcoin. It's not much, but it adds up.

Shared404 6y ago

> it is an abject failure as a currency. In the US perhaps. In at least one other country however... https://www.bbc.com/news/business-47553048 https://www.bbc.com/news/business-47553048 https://www.somagnews.com/bitcoin-becomes-the-dominant-currency-in-venezuela/ https://www.somagnews.com/bitcoin-becomes-the-dominant-curre...

riffraff 6y ago
The second article makes a pretty strong claim but does not seem to have any proof other than "Venezuela uses crypto a lot", doesn't it?

wsc981 6y ago

I feel it's also a pretty decent store of value. Now some people will probably want to tell me that it's a bad store of value, since the value can fluctuate quite a bit on a day-to-day basis. Sure that true, but in the long run I am confident the value will only go up, whereas many fiat currencies will only go down, especially now due to QE (basically printing money) that's happening in Eurozone, the US, and many other regions [0][1] in the world as well. So in my view, it's pretty nice as an alternative to holding gold. Gold can be nice as well of course, but it's difficult to transport. If you keep gold in your home, at some point someone might break into your home and steal your gold. You could pay some company to store your gold, but perhaps in times of crises a government might step in and claim some of your gold. Crypto currencies can be easily held in a digital wallet or people can even just memorise the keys to their wallet in their brain. It's hard for governments to control crypto currencies and I'm sure some of the wealthiest people in the world now keep a certain small percentage of their wealth in cryptos as well as a hedge against fiat currencies, stock market crashes, etc... --- [0]: https://news.bitcoin.com/venezuela-bitcoin-use-hyperinflation-crypto-adoption/ https://news.bitcoin.com/venezuela-bitcoin-use-hyperinflatio... [1]: https://www.financemagnates.com/cryptocurrency/the-impact-of-inflation-on-crypto-adoption/ https://www.financemagnates.com/cryptocurrency/the-impact-of...