5 ms·

https://archive.is/6iK6Z https://archive.is/6iK6Z

boplicity 6y ago
Do you have a suggestion for how WSJ should fund it's journalism? Maybe copyright infringement isn't an answer to that question.
- aaomidi 6y ago
  This is not the point of this article sent. If you want to start a discussion about funding newspapers make a new thread. Don't hijack this one.
- ivalm 6y ago
  As a former wsj subscriber I wish I could pay a la cart for the article. Perhaps $1-2? $37/month is high for a news source I usually read less than 5 articles per month. I already pay for Bloomberg/Economist/NYT/New Yorker but that’s because I regularly read double digit number of articles from them per month. At the same time when social media (like hn) sends me to wsj I would gladly contribute proportionally to my utilization.
  - tzs 6y ago
    So you'd pay $2/article, and read about 5 a month. That's $10/month. You can actually effectively kind of do that by getting an Apple News+ subscription. That's $10/month and includes WSJ articles. If you are reading on an iPad or iPhone and see a WSJ link on HN, hit Safari's share icon, and select News and it opens in the News app.
    - ivalm 6y ago
      I didn't know about this, I'll give it a go! Thanks! Edit: this is kind of interesting. I looked at Bloomberg and a few others and the subscriptions were comparable to their normal digital options. But WSJ is much cheaper on Apple News, why is this so? Is there some catch (like 2nd year is expensive)?
      - tzs 6y ago
        > But WSJ is much cheaper on Apple News, why is this so? Is there some catch (like 2nd year is expensive)? I have no idea. I mostly got a News+ subscription for the magazines. It has Scientific American, Consumer Reports, National Geographic, Popular Science, Popular Mechanics, Smithsonian, Wired, some Mac, Windows, and Linux magazines, Time, Newsweek, The New Yorker, Readers Digest, The New Republic, National Review, The Advocate, and a whole bunch more in a whole bunch of categories. I only regularly read a few of those, which is enough on its own to justify the subscription. Having all the rest there for when I occasionally want something different is a nice bonus.
- redwood 6y ago
  Fox News ought to provide ample funding
- tdhttt 6y ago
  Please check "Are paywalls ok?" at hacker news [FAQ](https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html) Also, previous discussion about WSJ: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13434938 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13434938
- flurdy 6y ago
  This is where Brave had a good idea with their micropayments to content providers [1], based on the sites you visited. You may not agree with their execution, and I don't think it will ever work, but I wish it did. * [1] https://creators.brave.com/ https://creators.brave.com/
  - ffpip 6y ago
    It will only be a matter of time before sites like Washington Post detect a Brave user and ask for instant transfer of BAT for access. Although Brave uses Chrome's UA, I think we can ask Brave for it's actual UA - https://github.com/brave/brave-browser/issues/8216 https://github.com/brave/brave-browser/issues/8216 I give WashP as an example because they are extremely anti adblock and most subscribers see ads too. They also have very hard ways to opt out of third party tracking.
- justjonathan 6y ago
  Maybe it is copyright infringement, maybe it’s fair use. Either way it is unsurprising. When I got the physical paper it was easy to share it with a coworker (I just handed him the newspaper) or I taped it up in the office kitchen to show everyone, or I clipped an article and sent it to a friend (you know in an envelope with a stamp,) If it was time sensitive I could call someone and tell the to buy today’s paper... They didn’t have to subscribe to read one day’s paper, much less a single article. *For the record, I’m a paid WSJ subscriber.
- jedberg 6y ago
  This was recently justified to me in an interesting way. Back in the heyday of print newspapers, you had your subscribers, who had the paper delivered every day. Then you had your casual readers who would pick it up at a newsstand if they saw an interesting article. And then you had your "freeloaders" -- the people who would read the paper at the library or fish it out of the trash or would ask to borrow it from the person on train next to them. These links are basically for the freeloaders who would never have paid anyway. Interestingly enough, most US libraries actually offer way to read these things for free by going through the library website, it's just not as easy as using an archive link.
- dang 6y ago
  Please don't do this here. There's nothing new to say, so the discussions are tedious and therefore off topic. Also, the question has been decided on HN for many years and is in the FAQ: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html. No one likes the current solution, it's just that the alternatives would suck worse. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&sort=byDate&type=comment&query=paywalls%20by:dang https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&so... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10178989 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10178989
  - boplicity 6y ago
    As a small publisher, strongly disagree with your stance. I regularly find articles of ours that have been re-published years ago without our consent. Unfortunately, the time it takes to file DMCA complaints is onerous, and this is for our relatively small publication. Despite attempts to deal with this, I still find republished articles that have been around for years. These republished articles do cause actual harm to our business, as they sometimes rank higher in search engine results than the original article. Larger publications, such as the WSJ would probably need several people working full time to deal with this situation, and still fail at catching many instances of infringement. In the case of an infringing article appearing on the front page of HN, that infringement leads to widespread unauthorized distribution. You wrote in a different comment "HN would suck worse without NYT, WSJ, Economist, etc." That argument is effectively: It is better to allow infringement, because the articles are worth reading. Just because something is worth stealing does not mean it should be stolen. Maybe if HN wants to contribute to supporting journalism – or at least finding a solution to the "problem" – you'll allow the "pain" of not supporting copyright infringement. Pain, after all, can be motivating.
    - read_if_gay_ 6y ago
      No one will feel that “pain” except submitters. No one is not going to sub to WSJ because they can just lurk around on HN until the article they want to read is posted. That just doesn’t make sense.
ffpip 6y ago
What kind of a paywall does WSJ have? I always get a wall. Is it X articles free per month, or do they allow only crawlers on their sites?
- bamboozled 6y ago
  I’ve seen other sites that do the same, it’s as if they just have a paywall permanently now and only say you can get a few free articles rather than mean it. You can never seem to trick it even if you want to...
  - jdc 6y ago
    ... it's almost like their server knows you're a person and not a crawler
- kyrra 6y ago
  They used to allow crawlers and Twitter and some other links through, but they're almost entirely behind a paywall now.links through Facebook or Twitter may still work, but they definitely do not work through Google anymore.
  - paulie_a 6y ago
    I blocked them from my Google feed as well as numerous other ones. I'm not going to pay to see ads
1vuio0pswjnm7 6y ago
That site is blocked in some countries. x=https://www.wsj.com/amp/articles/netflixs-reed-hastings-deems-remote-work-a-pure-negative-11599487219 curl $x |sed -n '/<title/s/.*/<!doctype html>&/;/<span/d;/<div/d;/<\/div/d;/./{/<amp-ad/,/<\/amp-ad/d;};/^ *{{summary.headline}}$/d;/<title>/,/<\/title>/p;/<p>/,/<\/p>/p' > 1.htm firefox ./1.htm Even easier (big, GUI browser might be overkill) links $x

Do you have a suggestion for how WSJ should fund it's journalism? Maybe copyright infringement isn't an answer to that question.

aaomidi 6y ago
This is not the point of this article sent. If you want to start a discussion about funding newspapers make a new thread. Don't hijack this one.
ivalm 6y ago
As a former wsj subscriber I wish I could pay a la cart for the article. Perhaps $1-2? $37/month is high for a news source I usually read less than 5 articles per month. I already pay for Bloomberg/Economist/NYT/New Yorker but that’s because I regularly read double digit number of articles from them per month. At the same time when social media (like hn) sends me to wsj I would gladly contribute proportionally to my utilization.
- tzs 6y ago
  So you'd pay $2/article, and read about 5 a month. That's $10/month. You can actually effectively kind of do that by getting an Apple News+ subscription. That's $10/month and includes WSJ articles. If you are reading on an iPad or iPhone and see a WSJ link on HN, hit Safari's share icon, and select News and it opens in the News app.
  - ivalm 6y ago
    I didn't know about this, I'll give it a go! Thanks! Edit: this is kind of interesting. I looked at Bloomberg and a few others and the subscriptions were comparable to their normal digital options. But WSJ is much cheaper on Apple News, why is this so? Is there some catch (like 2nd year is expensive)?
    - tzs 6y ago
      > But WSJ is much cheaper on Apple News, why is this so? Is there some catch (like 2nd year is expensive)? I have no idea. I mostly got a News+ subscription for the magazines. It has Scientific American, Consumer Reports, National Geographic, Popular Science, Popular Mechanics, Smithsonian, Wired, some Mac, Windows, and Linux magazines, Time, Newsweek, The New Yorker, Readers Digest, The New Republic, National Review, The Advocate, and a whole bunch more in a whole bunch of categories. I only regularly read a few of those, which is enough on its own to justify the subscription. Having all the rest there for when I occasionally want something different is a nice bonus.
redwood 6y ago
Fox News ought to provide ample funding
tdhttt 6y ago
Please check "Are paywalls ok?" at hacker news [FAQ](https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html) Also, previous discussion about WSJ: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13434938 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13434938
flurdy 6y ago
This is where Brave had a good idea with their micropayments to content providers [1], based on the sites you visited. You may not agree with their execution, and I don't think it will ever work, but I wish it did. * [1] https://creators.brave.com/ https://creators.brave.com/
- ffpip 6y ago
  It will only be a matter of time before sites like Washington Post detect a Brave user and ask for instant transfer of BAT for access. Although Brave uses Chrome's UA, I think we can ask Brave for it's actual UA - https://github.com/brave/brave-browser/issues/8216 https://github.com/brave/brave-browser/issues/8216 I give WashP as an example because they are extremely anti adblock and most subscribers see ads too. They also have very hard ways to opt out of third party tracking.
justjonathan 6y ago
Maybe it is copyright infringement, maybe it’s fair use. Either way it is unsurprising. When I got the physical paper it was easy to share it with a coworker (I just handed him the newspaper) or I taped it up in the office kitchen to show everyone, or I clipped an article and sent it to a friend (you know in an envelope with a stamp,) If it was time sensitive I could call someone and tell the to buy today’s paper... They didn’t have to subscribe to read one day’s paper, much less a single article. *For the record, I’m a paid WSJ subscriber.
jedberg 6y ago
This was recently justified to me in an interesting way. Back in the heyday of print newspapers, you had your subscribers, who had the paper delivered every day. Then you had your casual readers who would pick it up at a newsstand if they saw an interesting article. And then you had your "freeloaders" -- the people who would read the paper at the library or fish it out of the trash or would ask to borrow it from the person on train next to them. These links are basically for the freeloaders who would never have paid anyway. Interestingly enough, most US libraries actually offer way to read these things for free by going through the library website, it's just not as easy as using an archive link.
dang 6y ago
Please don't do this here. There's nothing new to say, so the discussions are tedious and therefore off topic. Also, the question has been decided on HN for many years and is in the FAQ: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html. No one likes the current solution, it's just that the alternatives would suck worse. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&sort=byDate&type=comment&query=paywalls%20by:dang https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&so... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10178989 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10178989
- boplicity 6y ago
  As a small publisher, strongly disagree with your stance. I regularly find articles of ours that have been re-published years ago without our consent. Unfortunately, the time it takes to file DMCA complaints is onerous, and this is for our relatively small publication. Despite attempts to deal with this, I still find republished articles that have been around for years. These republished articles do cause actual harm to our business, as they sometimes rank higher in search engine results than the original article. Larger publications, such as the WSJ would probably need several people working full time to deal with this situation, and still fail at catching many instances of infringement. In the case of an infringing article appearing on the front page of HN, that infringement leads to widespread unauthorized distribution. You wrote in a different comment "HN would suck worse without NYT, WSJ, Economist, etc." That argument is effectively: It is better to allow infringement, because the articles are worth reading. Just because something is worth stealing does not mean it should be stolen. Maybe if HN wants to contribute to supporting journalism – or at least finding a solution to the "problem" – you'll allow the "pain" of not supporting copyright infringement. Pain, after all, can be motivating.
  - read_if_gay_ 6y ago
    No one will feel that “pain” except submitters. No one is not going to sub to WSJ because they can just lurk around on HN until the article they want to read is posted. That just doesn’t make sense.

ffpip 6y ago

What kind of a paywall does WSJ have? I always get a wall. Is it X articles free per month, or do they allow only crawlers on their sites?

bamboozled 6y ago
I’ve seen other sites that do the same, it’s as if they just have a paywall permanently now and only say you can get a few free articles rather than mean it. You can never seem to trick it even if you want to...
- jdc 6y ago
  ... it's almost like their server knows you're a person and not a crawler
kyrra 6y ago
They used to allow crawlers and Twitter and some other links through, but they're almost entirely behind a paywall now.links through Facebook or Twitter may still work, but they definitely do not work through Google anymore.
- paulie_a 6y ago
  I blocked them from my Google feed as well as numerous other ones. I'm not going to pay to see ads

1vuio0pswjnm7 6y ago

That site is blocked in some countries. x=https://www.wsj.com/amp/articles/netflixs-reed-hastings-deems-remote-work-a-pure-negative-11599487219 curl $x |sed -n '/<title/s/.*/<!doctype html>&/;/<span/d;/<div/d;/<\/div/d;/./{/<amp-ad/,/<\/amp-ad/d;};/^ *{{summary.headline}}$/d;/<title>/,/<\/title>/p;/<p>/,/<\/p>/p' > 1.htm firefox ./1.htm Even easier (big, GUI browser might be overkill) links $x