5 ms·

I know a couple of people who suffer from carpal tunnel syndrome - and from what I understand moving your wrist is one of the things you're supposed to do to av

I know a couple of people who suffer from carpal tunnel syndrome - and from what I understand moving your wrist is one of the things you're supposed to do to avoid injuring your tendons - anchoring your wrist and moving your mouse solely with your fingers should be avoided. In fact, the Magic Mouse seems to be almost antithetical to everything I've been taught about mouse ergnomics

wazoox 6y ago
I think you have it backwards. Ergonomic mouse-pads have a big silicone pillow to rest your wrist on while you move your mouse with fingers only. Switching to such a mouse-pad is how my wife got rid of CTS.
- Guest19023892 6y ago
  For another point of comparison, what works for me is what the OP said is the worst, just moving the mouse with my finger tips. I also tried the mouse pads you mentioned, and they caused the most issues as they put pressure directly on my wrist. What I do is... I line up the armrest of my chair with the top of the desk so they're a level surface. I adjust the height of my chair so my arm is at a 90 degree angle. My arm runs flat across the arm rest and the desk, and my palm sits on the flat mouse pad. Then, I just move my finger tips to flick the mouse 1cm in any direction for getting to different sides of the screen. For keyboards it's similar. I use a thin and flat keyboard. This way my elbow (on the armrest), forearm, palm, and finger tips are all in a straight line. If I add any type of wrist rest, then the weight all goes to the wrist instead of being distributed. Lastly, I dislike keyboards and laptops that raise the backside because they raise my finger tips and put pressure on my wrist. It feels much more natural for the fingers to be lower or equal to the wrist and palm. Anyway, just my experience. I had some discomfort for a few years, and then nothing for the past decade.
  - sdflhasjd 6y ago
    I agree on the topic of mouse pads - What they're supposed to do is stop you from bending your wrist, but like you said, you end up with pressure on the very part you're trying to avoid. Did you ever get a chance to try a vertical ergonomic mouse? They take a while to get used to, but the idea is that you don't rotate your wrist (i.e your ulna and radius remain parallel) and keep it in a more neutral orientation.
    - Guest19023892 6y ago
      Oh, I never did try a vertical mouse. I remember seeing them for years but I never had a chance to spend time with one. It does seem like a much more natural hand position though.
      - mxmilkb 6y ago
        Fire me, it's a bit of a chore to mostly grip (apply forces in two ways with one hand) a vertical mouse for full fine control (rather than a regular mostly "push down"/hand rest grip).
- felixgallo 6y ago
  it's good to hear that your wife got rid of CTS, but generally the problem in the carpal area is one of pressure -- there is a bundle of nerves, tendons, blood vessels, etc., that go through the wrist. It's common for compression to cause problems. My wrist doctor advised me to avoid any pressure at all, because you can feel comfortable (e.g. with a pillowy surface) while still doing damage.
- gumby 6y ago
  Seems like putting force on your wrist is precisely what you should not do (whether weight or flex). Note that pianists are typically taught to keep the wrist/hand flat and rarely suffer CTS (Glenn Gould and Bernie Greenberg are notable and sad exceptions). Theoretically the best wrist “rest” in this scenario would be a bed of sharp nails..
hrktb 6y ago
We should keep in mind that ergonomic recommendations are for an average target at best, and won’t match a range of people’s use. Those people injured their tendons and now cover it with their wrist, other people will have other issues, with other workarounds.
- coldtea 6y ago
  >We should keep in mind that ergonomic recommendations are for an average target at best If you mean regarding to heights, distances, etc, yes. Else, Err, not really. Anatomy is anatomy, people don't have different design of hands, wrists, etc.
  - hrktb 6y ago
    People have different uses of their hands, wrists, different muscles and predispositions. For me personally the bottleneck was my finger’s middle joint, from too much mouse wheeling. Even for the targeted morphology, if you exactly stick to the recommended posture and input device etc. for 8h a day whole week, you will have issues anyway, it will just be a matter of what hurts first. The consensus as far as I know is to rotate posture (e.g. sitting/standing), input devices if possible, and try to avoid repetitive actions on always the same body parts.
  - mrob 6y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palmaris_longus_muscle https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palmaris_longus_muscle "It is absent in about 14 percent of the population"
httpsterio 6y ago
The wrist pad helps if the mouse is too large or the grip would force the holder's hand at an awkward angle. If your palm lays flat on the desk and your wrist is at an upward angle, that'll hurt your tendons pretty fast and affect your fingers and wrist. The wrist pad doesn't help a lot though because if you move the mouse with your fingers you'll have to grip the mouse more tightly rather than just rwst your hand on it and move it around by moving your forearm. Ideally your hand would be slightly rotated so that your pinky is closer to the desk and your thumb higher up and if you need something to elevate your hand, then the pad would be closer to your elbow so that you can use your forearm.

wazoox 6y ago

I think you have it backwards. Ergonomic mouse-pads have a big silicone pillow to rest your wrist on while you move your mouse with fingers only. Switching to such a mouse-pad is how my wife got rid of CTS.

Guest19023892 6y ago
For another point of comparison, what works for me is what the OP said is the worst, just moving the mouse with my finger tips. I also tried the mouse pads you mentioned, and they caused the most issues as they put pressure directly on my wrist. What I do is... I line up the armrest of my chair with the top of the desk so they're a level surface. I adjust the height of my chair so my arm is at a 90 degree angle. My arm runs flat across the arm rest and the desk, and my palm sits on the flat mouse pad. Then, I just move my finger tips to flick the mouse 1cm in any direction for getting to different sides of the screen. For keyboards it's similar. I use a thin and flat keyboard. This way my elbow (on the armrest), forearm, palm, and finger tips are all in a straight line. If I add any type of wrist rest, then the weight all goes to the wrist instead of being distributed. Lastly, I dislike keyboards and laptops that raise the backside because they raise my finger tips and put pressure on my wrist. It feels much more natural for the fingers to be lower or equal to the wrist and palm. Anyway, just my experience. I had some discomfort for a few years, and then nothing for the past decade.
- sdflhasjd 6y ago
  I agree on the topic of mouse pads - What they're supposed to do is stop you from bending your wrist, but like you said, you end up with pressure on the very part you're trying to avoid. Did you ever get a chance to try a vertical ergonomic mouse? They take a while to get used to, but the idea is that you don't rotate your wrist (i.e your ulna and radius remain parallel) and keep it in a more neutral orientation.
  - Guest19023892 6y ago
    Oh, I never did try a vertical mouse. I remember seeing them for years but I never had a chance to spend time with one. It does seem like a much more natural hand position though.
    - mxmilkb 6y ago
      Fire me, it's a bit of a chore to mostly grip (apply forces in two ways with one hand) a vertical mouse for full fine control (rather than a regular mostly "push down"/hand rest grip).
felixgallo 6y ago
it's good to hear that your wife got rid of CTS, but generally the problem in the carpal area is one of pressure -- there is a bundle of nerves, tendons, blood vessels, etc., that go through the wrist. It's common for compression to cause problems. My wrist doctor advised me to avoid any pressure at all, because you can feel comfortable (e.g. with a pillowy surface) while still doing damage.
gumby 6y ago
Seems like putting force on your wrist is precisely what you should not do (whether weight or flex). Note that pianists are typically taught to keep the wrist/hand flat and rarely suffer CTS (Glenn Gould and Bernie Greenberg are notable and sad exceptions). Theoretically the best wrist “rest” in this scenario would be a bed of sharp nails..

hrktb 6y ago

We should keep in mind that ergonomic recommendations are for an average target at best, and won’t match a range of people’s use. Those people injured their tendons and now cover it with their wrist, other people will have other issues, with other workarounds.

coldtea 6y ago
>We should keep in mind that ergonomic recommendations are for an average target at best If you mean regarding to heights, distances, etc, yes. Else, Err, not really. Anatomy is anatomy, people don't have different design of hands, wrists, etc.
- hrktb 6y ago
  People have different uses of their hands, wrists, different muscles and predispositions. For me personally the bottleneck was my finger’s middle joint, from too much mouse wheeling. Even for the targeted morphology, if you exactly stick to the recommended posture and input device etc. for 8h a day whole week, you will have issues anyway, it will just be a matter of what hurts first. The consensus as far as I know is to rotate posture (e.g. sitting/standing), input devices if possible, and try to avoid repetitive actions on always the same body parts.
- mrob 6y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palmaris_longus_muscle https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palmaris_longus_muscle "It is absent in about 14 percent of the population"

httpsterio 6y ago

The wrist pad helps if the mouse is too large or the grip would force the holder's hand at an awkward angle. If your palm lays flat on the desk and your wrist is at an upward angle, that'll hurt your tendons pretty fast and affect your fingers and wrist. The wrist pad doesn't help a lot though because if you move the mouse with your fingers you'll have to grip the mouse more tightly rather than just rwst your hand on it and move it around by moving your forearm. Ideally your hand would be slightly rotated so that your pinky is closer to the desk and your thumb higher up and if you need something to elevate your hand, then the pad would be closer to your elbow so that you can use your forearm.