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> Cargo is mandatory. On a similar line of thought, Rust’s compiler flags are not stable. Attempts to integrate it with other build systems have been met with h
by lights0123 6y ago
> Cargo is mandatory. On a similar line of thought, Rust’s compiler flags are not stable. Attempts to integrate it with other build systems have been met with hostility from the Rust & Cargo teams. The outside world exists, and us systems programmers spend a lot of our time integrating things. Rust refuses to play along.
Linux kernel maintainers doesn't want to use Cargo in the kernel ("Agreed, I wrote one ~half a year ago that compiled TUs through rustc mimicking what we do with cc to some degree (i.e. no cargo etc.), and it was quite pleasant." [1]), and there hasn't really been much opposition to that by the Rust team.
> However, nearly all programs needn’t be parallel. A program which uses poll effectively is going to be simpler, reasonably performant, and have orders of magnitude fewer bugs. “Fearless concurrency” allows you to fearlessly employ bad software design 9 times out of 10.
Sure, if you don't care about performance, which may very well be the case in many situations. However, the reality is that modern CPUs get their performance from multi-core workloads, requiring you to do things in parallel. Go does have some nice bits (e.g. no fragmentation between Tokio and smol, no need to separate code between async and non-async versions), but you don't explain what those are in depth.
> I especially refuse to “rewrite it in Rust”
Sure—that's mostly just a meme[2], which many people in the Rust world acknowledge is a bad thing[3].
[1]: https://lore.kernel.org/lkml/CAKwvOdmuYc8rW_H4aQG4DsJzho=F+djd68fp7mzmBp3-wY--Uw@mail.gmail.com/T/#u https://lore.kernel.org/lkml/CAKwvOdmuYc8rW_H4aQG4DsJzho=F+d...
[2]: https://www.reddit.com/r/rustjerk/comments/av5pog/higherres_rust_evangelism_strike_force_image/ https://www.reddit.com/r/rustjerk/comments/av5pog/higherres_...
[3]: https://www.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/ifkrvg/i_printed_rewrite_it_in_rust_swag_for_students/g2s1bh9 https://www.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/ifkrvg/i_printed_rewr...
- ColanR 6y ago> “rewrite it in Rust”...which many people in the Rust world acknowledge is a bad thing I've seen "rewrite it in Rust" mentioned plenty, even on HN; in fact, that meme colored much of my initial impression of Rust before I learned anything about it directly. I think the maintainers and the Rust world in general need to address that meme head on if they don't want it to be part of how Rust is known. Otherwise, as it stands currently, Rust is the language that's trying to replace C and rewrite everything that is C in Rust.
- Ar-Curunir 6y agoI mean, every rust forum has a "no language zealotry" rule in place, partially to head off the RIIR meme. I don't know what you want the Rust team to say, "Don't use Rust to improve your C projects"?
- ColanR 6y agoMaybe a clearly published outline of where their language fits in the ecosystem of languages that are out there. e.g., it improves on these aspects of C++, gets these traits from python, fixes these weaknesses of C, but doesn't improve on X, and Y is something that C still does better. Or something like that. Then there's something out there and clearly visible that immediately shuts down the zealotry because the maintainers have said exactly where Rust stands, and what they think it's great at, and what it doesn't do. Which seems like the problem: that the zealots are giving the impression that Rust is better than C for everything.