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I think he's suggesting that one of his criteria for package selection is his ability to contribute changes to the upstream project if needed, which he feels he

I think he's suggesting that one of his criteria for package selection is his ability to contribute changes to the upstream project if needed, which he feels he can't do for TypeScript on account of him not knowing the language.

timdaub 6y ago
Yep that's what I intended to say.
- oaiey 6y ago
  That is a valid point, but honestly, avoiding (learning) TypeScript as a modern day JavaScript developer is a mistake. I know it is annoying that there is a breach into the purity of the JavaScript language by a different actor. But let us face it: TS is useful, it is the right tool for the job and it is not niche. It complements JavaScript and solves problems JavaScript is structurally unable to solve. It helps and improves the JavaScript language. It helps millions of developers with static typing backgrounds to accept and deal with the imperfections of JavaScript. In my primary language - C# - there is tons of influx of functional programming nowadays (sourced via F# and OCaml). I could fight against it but I do not. I embrace change and adapt. Take the Linux Kernel: After three decades of C code they are talking/merging support for Rust. Why: it is the right thing and it is a good complement for their C tooling.
  - timdaub 6y ago
    > That is a valid point, but honestly, avoiding (learning) TypeScript as a modern day JavaScript developer is a mistake. You're probably right. My argument, however, was purely about separation of concerns: different language means different package manager (or namespace...).
    - oaiey 6y ago
      I disagree. Node and the browsers script engines are virtual machines nowadays. Package managers go by VMs not by language.
      - timdaub 6y ago
        Not sure I get your argument. As far as I understand there's no VM for Typescript specifically. Hence as "no VM" is different from Spidermonkey/V8, Typescript packages should go into its own package manager?
        virtue3 6y ago
        A kotlin project is going to use both java and kotlin sources (and maybe closure). We're going to start seeing a lot more WASM stuff on npm, which is going to be whatever language anyone wants. The VM for typescript is node/browser. Because it gets compiled to target those.
  - wryoak 6y ago
    >It helps millions of developers with static typing backgrounds to accept and deal with the imperfections of JavaScript. Ah, just like when I made my superset of Spanish that gets rid of all those pesky verb endings and gendered articles and adjectives. People complained: "BUT THIS ISN'T SPANISH!" But really, why should any language be different from any other? It's just an impediment to their adoption.

timdaub 6y ago

Yep that's what I intended to say.

oaiey 6y ago
That is a valid point, but honestly, avoiding (learning) TypeScript as a modern day JavaScript developer is a mistake. I know it is annoying that there is a breach into the purity of the JavaScript language by a different actor. But let us face it: TS is useful, it is the right tool for the job and it is not niche. It complements JavaScript and solves problems JavaScript is structurally unable to solve. It helps and improves the JavaScript language. It helps millions of developers with static typing backgrounds to accept and deal with the imperfections of JavaScript. In my primary language - C# - there is tons of influx of functional programming nowadays (sourced via F# and OCaml). I could fight against it but I do not. I embrace change and adapt. Take the Linux Kernel: After three decades of C code they are talking/merging support for Rust. Why: it is the right thing and it is a good complement for their C tooling.
- timdaub 6y ago
  > That is a valid point, but honestly, avoiding (learning) TypeScript as a modern day JavaScript developer is a mistake. You're probably right. My argument, however, was purely about separation of concerns: different language means different package manager (or namespace...).
  - oaiey 6y ago
    I disagree. Node and the browsers script engines are virtual machines nowadays. Package managers go by VMs not by language.
    - timdaub 6y ago
      Not sure I get your argument. As far as I understand there's no VM for Typescript specifically. Hence as "no VM" is different from Spidermonkey/V8, Typescript packages should go into its own package manager?
      - virtue3 6y ago
        A kotlin project is going to use both java and kotlin sources (and maybe closure). We're going to start seeing a lot more WASM stuff on npm, which is going to be whatever language anyone wants. The VM for typescript is node/browser. Because it gets compiled to target those.
- wryoak 6y ago
  >It helps millions of developers with static typing backgrounds to accept and deal with the imperfections of JavaScript. Ah, just like when I made my superset of Spanish that gets rid of all those pesky verb endings and gendered articles and adjectives. People complained: "BUT THIS ISN'T SPANISH!" But really, why should any language be different from any other? It's just an impediment to their adoption.