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There are two entirely different matters being conflated here: "Where will crime happen" prediction, which is based on crime reporting data for the most part a

There are two entirely different matters being conflated here: "Where will crime happen" prediction, which is based on crime reporting data for the most part and, as a sibling by comment by motohagiography articulates very well, the solution is upstream. This tool is useful, but problematic. Especially with "more encounters with police lead to more charges of all types" issues. "Who will commit crime" predictions are just plain problematic; they discard the entire premise of innocent until proven guilty that is supposed to underlie Canadian enforcement and jurisprudence as well as tend to be self fulfilling prophecies.

oh_sigh 6y ago
In what manner is it problematic? No one is being punished by the system predicting that they will commit a crime.
- core-questions 6y ago
  It's problematic because of the demographics of the areas and of the people who are predicted to commit crimes, of course. If the system doesn't spit out a perfectly egalitarian, proportional representation of the population down to an infinite level of granularity, it must be wrong; just like all the other machine learning systems that have been revealed to have incredible bias by similarly pointing out things that agree with observable, measured reality.
- mLuby 6y ago
  So you would be okay with police driving behind you for years, waiting for you to make a mistake? Uneven application of even a just law is still unjust, and also undermines trust in the justice system.
  - oh_sigh 6y ago
    Again... is tracking and following potential future-criminals actually what this tech is used for?
    - Ensorceled 6y ago
      https://projects.tampabay.com/projects/2020/investigations/police-pasco-sheriff-targeted/intelligence-led-policing/ https://projects.tampabay.com/projects/2020/investigations/p...
  - lawnchair_larry 6y ago
    This doesn’t do either of those things.
- JamisonM 6y ago
  > No one is being punished by the system predicting that they will commit a crime. It seems very obvious to me that any system that would send the police to my door to question me when I have not in fact committed any nor am suspected of any actual crime that has occured it is punishing me. The inconvenience alone is a punishment. The increased probability that I will have some unrelated matter used against me is a punishment. The fact that my neighbours see law enforcement officers visiting me is a punishment. Seems plenty problematic to me.

oh_sigh 6y ago

In what manner is it problematic? No one is being punished by the system predicting that they will commit a crime.

core-questions 6y ago
It's problematic because of the demographics of the areas and of the people who are predicted to commit crimes, of course. If the system doesn't spit out a perfectly egalitarian, proportional representation of the population down to an infinite level of granularity, it must be wrong; just like all the other machine learning systems that have been revealed to have incredible bias by similarly pointing out things that agree with observable, measured reality.
mLuby 6y ago
So you would be okay with police driving behind you for years, waiting for you to make a mistake? Uneven application of even a just law is still unjust, and also undermines trust in the justice system.
- oh_sigh 6y ago
  Again... is tracking and following potential future-criminals actually what this tech is used for?
  - Ensorceled 6y ago
    https://projects.tampabay.com/projects/2020/investigations/police-pasco-sheriff-targeted/intelligence-led-policing/ https://projects.tampabay.com/projects/2020/investigations/p...
- lawnchair_larry 6y ago
  This doesn’t do either of those things.
JamisonM 6y ago
> No one is being punished by the system predicting that they will commit a crime. It seems very obvious to me that any system that would send the police to my door to question me when I have not in fact committed any nor am suspected of any actual crime that has occured it is punishing me. The inconvenience alone is a punishment. The increased probability that I will have some unrelated matter used against me is a punishment. The fact that my neighbours see law enforcement officers visiting me is a punishment. Seems plenty problematic to me.