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> so what's the alternative I think it's quite odd we nowadays think cars are the only possible form of transportation. We are not born with 4 wheels underneat
by donjoe 6y ago
> so what's the alternative
I think it's quite odd we nowadays think cars are the only possible form of transportation. We are not born with 4 wheels underneath our butt.
The alternative is to build structures build for foot or bicycle traffic. Everything within 10k can easily be reached by either bicycle or foot traffic. By building infrastructure for cars, you create distances which are for cars only. They would otherwise not exist.
> enabling them to find houses and jobs in the most economical and convenient places
That's only possible due to the external costs of cars not being accounted for. Burning dinosaurs and destruction of nature is nowhere to be found in cars. If you would price cars accordingly, we would start planning differently.
> once public transit become monopolistic
We already have the same monopolistic issue just right now with cars as the only means of transportation. Without cars, you're not able to move in large parts of the U.S. This excludes about 50%+ of the U.S. population (children < 16yo, people who cannot afford cars or cannot drive themselves due to health reasons).
> private cars win over public transit because it's a better product
Why are cars a better product?
Commute and travel time are a huge economical factor destroying time. They take up loads of space and require infrastructure and maintenance paid by society.
> dependency on public transit times.
That's a political issue which could be solved. Most of the money spent nowadays is spent on parking spots and car roads. If you would spend the same amount on public transport, you could probably run a train every 5 minutes.
> too bad, transit only gives peak service at peak hours.
That's also how we design our roads. They need to accomodate peak traffic at peak hours. Otherwise they're an unused piece of asphalt.
> the car has been a great economical equalizer and still is
Again, not taking into account external costs. Road traffic kills ~ 1.2M people each year insuring even more which do have a massive impact on the health system.
> pollution is something to be solved
By solving pollution but still focusing on urban sprawl and keeping traffic as-is, we will do the wrong thing better. That's an achievement but not solving the issue.
Feel free to watch the interview mentioned before. It does clarify some of the points I just mentioned: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_x5Hor2MP8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_x5Hor2MP8
[edit: formatting]
- throwaway316943 6y agoYour argument still doesn’t make a clear case for removing cars. All those problems could also be solved by improving cars and infrastructure which has the added benefit of not completely demolishing and rebuilding around a system where you have to schlep your groceries up a hill in the rain on an old bicycle.
- donjoe 6y agoAlright, there are some options: a) keep everything as is. Leave up to 80% of public space to cars (as in L.A. for example), destroy all social interactions which could otherwise happen in those places, increase commute time due to cities designed around long distances and destroy our environment. b) buy a new bicycle and a good rain coat, use our feet, expand public transport, improve our wellbeing by doing some exercise, reduce obesity and diabetes, socialize in public space again and save tons of tax payer's money. Whilst saving the life of 1.2m people. Which one sounds better to you?
- LoSboccacc 6y agothis isn't a proposal but wishful thinking there's a load of people, especially in big cities, that commute further than feasible with bicycle. and no, people will not want to live within biking range from heavy industry.
- throwaway316943 6y agoB only applies to relatively wealthy, childless people living close to where they work. A is a straw man. There’s no innovation there. We need to redesign roads so that they are invisible and uncongestible. We either have to do personal air travel, which we don’t have the power density for yet or underground which is looking more promising. All people moving cars need to be electric and self driving. A car should be like a universal elevator, just get in and push a button. That’s the best option, 0 time dedicated to piloting your body through space and you’re able to live anywhere and work anywhere.