3 ms·

Picking up my copy of Webster's Ninth New Collegiate Dictionary and looking up "racism", I see "1. a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits

by fouric 6y ago

Picking up my copy of Webster's Ninth New Collegiate Dictionary and looking up "racism", I see "1. a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race" (which isn't relevant to the point being made) and "2. racial prejudice or discrimination" which perfectly describes affirmative action - people of a particular race being discriminated against because of their race. This is literally textbook racism. I'm really curious what arguments the downvoters of the parent post have to say and why they didn't say them.

AlexTWithBeard 6y ago
I firmly believe that race is a primary determinant of some human traits and capacities, such as capacity to spend half a day in the sun without getting burnt. Look, like any religion, both racism and racial equality statements require careful interpretation by certified personnel. Applying common sense will inevitably lead to blasphemy and the producer of the heresy will be burnt at the stake.
p49k 6y ago
You and others are providing a willfully ignorant and overly simplistic presentation of what affirmative action is. Your question is in bad faith. I don’t agree with a lot of political opinions of others but I don’t try to pretend like I don’t understand where they are coming from. Requiring someone to explain something you already know is how you would keep people eternally occupied with meaningless work, not what you would do to have a fruitful conversation. What you’re doing here is one reason why no one ever makes any progress these days in resolving their differences.
- AlexTWithBeard 6y ago
  In my extremely humble opinion this discussion would benefit if parent's question was given a benefit of doubt accompanied with a good, substantiated, logical answer. Otherwise you are preaching to the choir, my friend.
- User23 6y ago
  Assuming the sale on your premises is solid rhetoric, but since this is meant to be a dialectical site your reply is a bit lacking. Why don't you state your unstated premises that you assume your interlocutor is knowingly ignoring to support your claim of bad faith?
- javert 6y ago
  I don't think the question was in bad faith. I don't understand why it would be seen that way. Many people view affirmative action as racist. I could even imagine there existing a proponent of affirmative action who says, "Yes, I concede it's racist, but it's racist for the sake of helping the downtrodden, not racist for the sake of hurting the downtrodden, so it's OK." So if people want to argue against affirmative action, they probably need to say why it's bad specifically, not just that it's racist.
- fouric 6y ago
  The Wikipedia page[1] on affirmative action says that it includes "promoting diversity", which means artificially adding diversity by discriminating against majorities, which is consistent with my personal experience and the way I've heard other people use the term, and is consistent with he argument that I was making. Meanwhile, you didn't even attempt to provide nuance to my interpretation of "affirmative action", nor did you try to counter my argument in any way whatsoever. Seems more like you're in bad faith by trying to use a vague claim like "overly simplistic" without providing any sort of support. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirmative_action https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirmative_action

by fouric 6y ago

AlexTWithBeard 6y ago

I firmly believe that race is a primary determinant of some human traits and capacities, such as capacity to spend half a day in the sun without getting burnt. Look, like any religion, both racism and racial equality statements require careful interpretation by certified personnel. Applying common sense will inevitably lead to blasphemy and the producer of the heresy will be burnt at the stake.

p49k 6y ago

You and others are providing a willfully ignorant and overly simplistic presentation of what affirmative action is. Your question is in bad faith. I don’t agree with a lot of political opinions of others but I don’t try to pretend like I don’t understand where they are coming from. Requiring someone to explain something you already know is how you would keep people eternally occupied with meaningless work, not what you would do to have a fruitful conversation. What you’re doing here is one reason why no one ever makes any progress these days in resolving their differences.

AlexTWithBeard 6y ago
In my extremely humble opinion this discussion would benefit if parent's question was given a benefit of doubt accompanied with a good, substantiated, logical answer. Otherwise you are preaching to the choir, my friend.
User23 6y ago
Assuming the sale on your premises is solid rhetoric, but since this is meant to be a dialectical site your reply is a bit lacking. Why don't you state your unstated premises that you assume your interlocutor is knowingly ignoring to support your claim of bad faith?
javert 6y ago
I don't think the question was in bad faith. I don't understand why it would be seen that way. Many people view affirmative action as racist. I could even imagine there existing a proponent of affirmative action who says, "Yes, I concede it's racist, but it's racist for the sake of helping the downtrodden, not racist for the sake of hurting the downtrodden, so it's OK." So if people want to argue against affirmative action, they probably need to say why it's bad specifically, not just that it's racist.
fouric 6y ago
The Wikipedia page[1] on affirmative action says that it includes "promoting diversity", which means artificially adding diversity by discriminating against majorities, which is consistent with my personal experience and the way I've heard other people use the term, and is consistent with he argument that I was making. Meanwhile, you didn't even attempt to provide nuance to my interpretation of "affirmative action", nor did you try to counter my argument in any way whatsoever. Seems more like you're in bad faith by trying to use a vague claim like "overly simplistic" without providing any sort of support. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirmative_action https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirmative_action