4 ms·

There is so much dependency on proprietary technologies here that anyone pursue anything serious should just stay away from the suggested architectures. If AWS

There is so much dependency on proprietary technologies here that anyone pursue anything serious should just stay away from the suggested architectures. If AWS were to raise prices in the future or to kick you off the platform, it would be that much harder to move elsewhere.

NomDePlum 6y ago
Are those scenarios more or less likely than AWS lowering prices and in the future not kicking you off. If it takes less effort and time to build something with proprietary technology surely that is a benefit? You can then assess whether removing that dependency improves your position.
jedberg 6y ago
Would you say the same thing to someone building all their software to compile on Intel? What if Intel doubles the prices of their CPUs? Then what? The lock in argument is sort of silly. Everything has some sort of lock in. It's just a question of whether the benefits outweigh the potential costs of the lock in. In the case of AWS, they give you incredible velocity since you don't have to built any of the infrastructure before you get started.
- ryukafalz 6y ago
  > Would you say the same thing to someone building all their software to compile on Intel? If they’re targeting Intel processors only and not x86 more generally? Yes, I would. Otherwise, there’s at least one credible competitor (AMD) that’ll gladly sell you compatible processors, who I’m sure would be happy to see the increased sales if Intel jacked up their prices.
  - jedberg 6y ago
    AWS has two competitors, so I'd make the same argument back to you.
    - harshitaneja 6y ago
      You can run something compiled for x86 on AMD without modifications. That is not true for custom proprietary tools from cloud providers. All have more or less equivalent offerings but the cost to migrate are not negligible in a large number of cases. So lock in is more of a concern here. And even with processor architectures, I have started considering ARM migration as ARM has started becoming more popular in cloud. This is not to say I don't believe these tools have their benefits, just that the benefits need to be really weighed against the cost on lock-in, which in my opinion are quite understated with those who choose to use it without a second thought.
    - ryukafalz 6y ago
      As a sibling comment pointed out, applications built for x86 PCs don't even need to be recompiled to run on compatible processors by another manufacturer. (Heck, even across architectures you can usually recompile relatively easily provided the software is written in a high-level language with a compiler available there.) That is very much not the case with cloud providers' APIs; they're largely provider-specific. The closest equivalent in the cloud provider ecosystem is probably Kubernetes; there are provider-specific extensions (and I recommend avoiding those where possible) but largely things work the same across providers. I'd say a more representative example of lock-in in the PC ecosystem is that of proprietary OS vendors. If you're targeting specifically iOS/Android (w/ Play Services)/macOS/Windows/etc, then yes, you're beholden to the vendor (to varying degrees in each case). You may accept that risk, but you should always be aware of it.
social_quotient 6y ago
Their track record would suggest the opposite, and while I get what you’re saying on the price side I feel AWS is pretty trust worthy here? Open to a counter thought here if I’m missing something. I can’t speak to the getting kicked off side.
deegles 6y ago
I know it's not evidence that it won't happen in the future, but how often has AWS raised prices on a service? I would bet it's less than a handful of times, and never on an established product.

NomDePlum 6y ago

Are those scenarios more or less likely than AWS lowering prices and in the future not kicking you off. If it takes less effort and time to build something with proprietary technology surely that is a benefit? You can then assess whether removing that dependency improves your position.

jedberg 6y ago

Would you say the same thing to someone building all their software to compile on Intel? What if Intel doubles the prices of their CPUs? Then what? The lock in argument is sort of silly. Everything has some sort of lock in. It's just a question of whether the benefits outweigh the potential costs of the lock in. In the case of AWS, they give you incredible velocity since you don't have to built any of the infrastructure before you get started.

ryukafalz 6y ago
> Would you say the same thing to someone building all their software to compile on Intel? If they’re targeting Intel processors only and not x86 more generally? Yes, I would. Otherwise, there’s at least one credible competitor (AMD) that’ll gladly sell you compatible processors, who I’m sure would be happy to see the increased sales if Intel jacked up their prices.
- jedberg 6y ago
  AWS has two competitors, so I'd make the same argument back to you.
  - harshitaneja 6y ago
    You can run something compiled for x86 on AMD without modifications. That is not true for custom proprietary tools from cloud providers. All have more or less equivalent offerings but the cost to migrate are not negligible in a large number of cases. So lock in is more of a concern here. And even with processor architectures, I have started considering ARM migration as ARM has started becoming more popular in cloud. This is not to say I don't believe these tools have their benefits, just that the benefits need to be really weighed against the cost on lock-in, which in my opinion are quite understated with those who choose to use it without a second thought.
  - ryukafalz 6y ago
    As a sibling comment pointed out, applications built for x86 PCs don't even need to be recompiled to run on compatible processors by another manufacturer. (Heck, even across architectures you can usually recompile relatively easily provided the software is written in a high-level language with a compiler available there.) That is very much not the case with cloud providers' APIs; they're largely provider-specific. The closest equivalent in the cloud provider ecosystem is probably Kubernetes; there are provider-specific extensions (and I recommend avoiding those where possible) but largely things work the same across providers. I'd say a more representative example of lock-in in the PC ecosystem is that of proprietary OS vendors. If you're targeting specifically iOS/Android (w/ Play Services)/macOS/Windows/etc, then yes, you're beholden to the vendor (to varying degrees in each case). You may accept that risk, but you should always be aware of it.

social_quotient 6y ago

Their track record would suggest the opposite, and while I get what you’re saying on the price side I feel AWS is pretty trust worthy here? Open to a counter thought here if I’m missing something. I can’t speak to the getting kicked off side.

deegles 6y ago

I know it's not evidence that it won't happen in the future, but how often has AWS raised prices on a service? I would bet it's less than a handful of times, and never on an established product.