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This is likely to be unpopular. Here goes. Is it possible that Jacob is calling others "cowardly" because he wants to prove how brave he is? Taking a leadersh

This is likely to be unpopular. Here goes. Is it possible that Jacob is calling others "cowardly" because he wants to prove how brave he is? Taking a leadership role in a movement of moral prescience is at once commendable, laudable but also dangerous, onerous. I really appreciate what Jacob is doing by putting his face to the Wikileaks organization. It is something that I personally would not want to do. Wikileaks' stated goal is to "...be of assistance to people of all regions who wish to reveal unethical behaviour in their governments and corporations." In this, Jacob is succeeding. He is assuredly revealing this behavior through personal sacrifice. Part one is complete. Rejoice. Step two will be about knowledge. Now it is up to supporters of this cause to spread that information as far and as wide as possible. We've already seen the power of knowledge in this first quarter of 2011. A reality that wikileaks, twitter, the internet and the freedom of information has wrought. Instead of spreading this message, Jacob seems to sprinkle a bit of guilt and self aggrandizing. Maybe I am speaking out of turn because the only interaction with Jacob I have is seen in here in this thread. However, let's take a step back from our Jacob- and self-imposed guilt and execute the next stage. Edit: By all means we should empathize with Jacob and try to understand his sacrifice. We do not, however, all have to be martyrs in order to be Good(tm).

Pahalial 16y ago
What? How does this.. what? You seem to contradict yourself: you admit he is spreading knowledge of the governments' misbehavior (and that this is a laudable thing) and then.. question mark? Upon 5th reread: are you actually accusing him of falsely accusing others of cowardice for self-aggrandizement because these 'others' (aka: us) are not spreading the word of governmental misbehavior fast enough? I seriously can't see any other statement in your comment, and it seems like even the anti-Jacob sentiment I quote above died after the third sentence - I'm just trying to string a single thought through the whole comment. Please clarify.
gitarr 16y ago
I think people who stand on the side lines and do not take part in movements that have an open and objectively good cause could be called part of the problem by not doing anything. Let me give an example: In my country, when a motorist witnesses an accident with injured people, he is required by law to provide first aid to the injured and call additional help to the scene. Needless to say, first aid education is required when applying for a drivers license here. Some people will help if they see injured people on the side of the road and some people will not. I call the latter cowards and they are doing harm by not providing timely help or even call for professional help. People die because other people look away and ignore them. Now, I think what ioerror is doing is brave, and everybody not doing the same or more is a coward (including me, I'd like to do more, yet all I can do is trying to make information available to as many people as possible). He does not look away. Bradley Manning did not look away. He is the one who is the bravest man in this equation. He knew what he did would have consequences, yet looking away while innocent people get mown down video-game stile needs a special kind of ignorance and evil to be able to ignore or even call it OK. The US government is able to do that at the moment including large parts of the population. Cowards, all of them.
- mtex 16y ago
  "Cowards, all of them." I don't think they are cowards, though I do think that Appelbaum's public defeatism with regards to his refusal to sue the DHS is going to discourage a lot of people who would have also sued the DHS over similar treatment (Appelbaum is not alone, though he wants you to think he is) from doing so. Appelbaum earns triple the American average and can't get a lawyer. People who earn less than him (the overwhelming majority of Americans) are going to look at this, think to themselves: "This guy has more money than I do, yet even he can't get a lawyer to sue the DHS", and give up before they've even started.
  - ioerror 16y ago
    Public defeatism? I'm sorry but you're simply not seeing the bigger picture here. Silence is defeat. I am speaking up about what is happening to thousands of people by telling my story. I have never claimed that I am alone. Quite the contrary actually - I told the author of this story that I am but one of thousands.
ioerror 16y ago
No, that is not possible as that is not my intention.
mtex 16y ago
"Instead of spreading this message, Jacob seems to sprinkle a bit of guilt and self aggrandizing" Hammerdr, I couldn't agree with you more. Willfull masochism is not bravery, or some activist good guy bagde of achievement. It's sad that our society mistakes the one with the other. Appelbaum, I will be even more blunt than the previous commenter and say that I think you are wallowing in your Jesus complex. If you were serious about all this you would have already sued the DHS the first time you were harassed. You've been held up and hassled, how many times already? I've already lost count. You would have called up Jesse Ventura's lawyer and asked him to represent you as well. You would have contacted Alex Jones from Infowars, who specializes in reporting on DHS harassment, and gotten on his show. Instead, you keep coming back for more abuse like a masochist. You're 100% Jesus to me, and I don't mean that in a flattering way. Stop taking it, stop being a politically correct victim, get a lawyer and fight back. And stop calling people who question your ineffectual and pointless public masochism "trolls", "cowards" and "stalkers".
- brl 16y ago
  > And stop calling people who question your ineffectual and pointless public masochism "trolls", "cowards" and "stalkers". You made a HN account just to throw personal attacks at Jacob and think it's unfair to be called a troll or a stalker? That's exactly what you are.
- ioerror 16y ago
  You have no idea what actions I am taking or not taking. However, you have shown that you are not interested in supporting me when I discuss the harassment that I receive. For example, if I filed formal complaints or suit against CBP, would you support my actions? If so, why do you not support the actions that you have seen so far? If not, why are you here? Just to tell me that there is a single way to respond and that I'm wrong? Do you really believe that I should simply be silent about the specific harassment that I receive? There is more than one way to respond and I'm taking all of my options seriously. Your presumption of knowledge about my actions is of course incorrect and your arrogance is showing.

Pahalial 16y ago

What? How does this.. what? You seem to contradict yourself: you admit he is spreading knowledge of the governments' misbehavior (and that this is a laudable thing) and then.. question mark? Upon 5th reread: are you actually accusing him of falsely accusing others of cowardice for self-aggrandizement because these 'others' (aka: us) are not spreading the word of governmental misbehavior fast enough? I seriously can't see any other statement in your comment, and it seems like even the anti-Jacob sentiment I quote above died after the third sentence - I'm just trying to string a single thought through the whole comment. Please clarify.

gitarr 16y ago

I think people who stand on the side lines and do not take part in movements that have an open and objectively good cause could be called part of the problem by not doing anything. Let me give an example: In my country, when a motorist witnesses an accident with injured people, he is required by law to provide first aid to the injured and call additional help to the scene. Needless to say, first aid education is required when applying for a drivers license here. Some people will help if they see injured people on the side of the road and some people will not. I call the latter cowards and they are doing harm by not providing timely help or even call for professional help. People die because other people look away and ignore them. Now, I think what ioerror is doing is brave, and everybody not doing the same or more is a coward (including me, I'd like to do more, yet all I can do is trying to make information available to as many people as possible). He does not look away. Bradley Manning did not look away. He is the one who is the bravest man in this equation. He knew what he did would have consequences, yet looking away while innocent people get mown down video-game stile needs a special kind of ignorance and evil to be able to ignore or even call it OK. The US government is able to do that at the moment including large parts of the population. Cowards, all of them.

mtex 16y ago
"Cowards, all of them." I don't think they are cowards, though I do think that Appelbaum's public defeatism with regards to his refusal to sue the DHS is going to discourage a lot of people who would have also sued the DHS over similar treatment (Appelbaum is not alone, though he wants you to think he is) from doing so. Appelbaum earns triple the American average and can't get a lawyer. People who earn less than him (the overwhelming majority of Americans) are going to look at this, think to themselves: "This guy has more money than I do, yet even he can't get a lawyer to sue the DHS", and give up before they've even started.
- ioerror 16y ago
  Public defeatism? I'm sorry but you're simply not seeing the bigger picture here. Silence is defeat. I am speaking up about what is happening to thousands of people by telling my story. I have never claimed that I am alone. Quite the contrary actually - I told the author of this story that I am but one of thousands.

ioerror 16y ago

No, that is not possible as that is not my intention.

mtex 16y ago

"Instead of spreading this message, Jacob seems to sprinkle a bit of guilt and self aggrandizing" Hammerdr, I couldn't agree with you more. Willfull masochism is not bravery, or some activist good guy bagde of achievement. It's sad that our society mistakes the one with the other. Appelbaum, I will be even more blunt than the previous commenter and say that I think you are wallowing in your Jesus complex. If you were serious about all this you would have already sued the DHS the first time you were harassed. You've been held up and hassled, how many times already? I've already lost count. You would have called up Jesse Ventura's lawyer and asked him to represent you as well. You would have contacted Alex Jones from Infowars, who specializes in reporting on DHS harassment, and gotten on his show. Instead, you keep coming back for more abuse like a masochist. You're 100% Jesus to me, and I don't mean that in a flattering way. Stop taking it, stop being a politically correct victim, get a lawyer and fight back. And stop calling people who question your ineffectual and pointless public masochism "trolls", "cowards" and "stalkers".

brl 16y ago
> And stop calling people who question your ineffectual and pointless public masochism "trolls", "cowards" and "stalkers". You made a HN account just to throw personal attacks at Jacob and think it's unfair to be called a troll or a stalker? That's exactly what you are.
ioerror 16y ago
You have no idea what actions I am taking or not taking. However, you have shown that you are not interested in supporting me when I discuss the harassment that I receive. For example, if I filed formal complaints or suit against CBP, would you support my actions? If so, why do you not support the actions that you have seen so far? If not, why are you here? Just to tell me that there is a single way to respond and that I'm wrong? Do you really believe that I should simply be silent about the specific harassment that I receive? There is more than one way to respond and I'm taking all of my options seriously. Your presumption of knowledge about my actions is of course incorrect and your arrogance is showing.