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I am aware of that, however it is much easier to win an antitrust case against a company that has 95% market share. > The jurisprudence on this actually starts

I am aware of that, however it is much easier to win an antitrust case against a company that has 95% market share. > The jurisprudence on this actually starts at 40%. Can you provide more background on this?

inopinatus 6y ago
You can do worse than start with the, er, "brief synopsis" of the history of Article 102 at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_102_of_the_Treaty_on_the_Functioning_of_the_European_Union https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_102_of_the_Treaty_on_t.... As one might imagine the full history is a bottomless pit of claim, counterclaim, strong-arm tactics, PR, subversion, argument, opinion etc where the truth goes to die.
- nodamage 6y ago
  You're citing EU law but this case between Apple and Epic is happening in a US court, which has historically held higher requirements for the finding of monopoly power (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24312856 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24312856). For what it's worth I do agree that Epic would be more likely to prevail if this case was under EU jurisdiction.
  - inopinatus 6y ago
    Yes, my remark above was about EU fines applied to Microsoft. What might lead one to think it hasn't already attracted the interest of regulators outside the US? These battles are fought globally.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
    - username90 6y ago
      EU has already started an antitrust investigation into apples app store. Most likely they will get hit with a huge fine. > The European Commission has opened formal antitrust investigations to assess whether Apple's rules for app developers on the distribution of apps via the App Store violate EU competition rules. The investigations concern in particular the mandatory use of Apple's own proprietary in-app purchase system and restrictions on the ability of developers to inform iPhone and iPad users of alternative cheaper purchasing possibilities outside of apps. https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_20_1073 https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_20_...
  - Xixi 6y ago
    I don't think iPhone/iOS market shares in the EU are high enough. I couldn't find a definitive source, but it seems to be somewhere between 14% [1] and 25% [2], the latter in the wealthier European markets. These numbers also include UK (I think), a traditionally strong market for Apple, but which should be out of EU Single Market by the end of the year. IANAL, but I don't think that's enough for Epic to have a case in the EU. On the other hand I could see the EU being more likely than the US to regulate these kind of stores, to try to protect European editors against Apple/Google. But the lobbying would have to come from European editors, not from Epic. [1] https://9to5mac.com/2019/08/12/iphone-market-share-in-europe/ https://9to5mac.com/2019/08/12/iphone-market-share-in-europe... [2] https://macdailynews.com/2020/01/29/iphone-takes-24-3-smartphone-share-across-five-major-eu-markets/ https://macdailynews.com/2020/01/29/iphone-takes-24-3-smartp...
    - inopinatus 6y ago
      This isn’t about device sales. The market in consideration is the $100bn/yr app-store market, of which Apple has 2/3 globally and around 55% of the European segment in 2019.

inopinatus 6y ago

You can do worse than start with the, er, "brief synopsis" of the history of Article 102 at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_102_of_the_Treaty_on_the_Functioning_of_the_European_Union https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_102_of_the_Treaty_on_t.... As one might imagine the full history is a bottomless pit of claim, counterclaim, strong-arm tactics, PR, subversion, argument, opinion etc where the truth goes to die.

nodamage 6y ago
You're citing EU law but this case between Apple and Epic is happening in a US court, which has historically held higher requirements for the finding of monopoly power (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24312856 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24312856). For what it's worth I do agree that Epic would be more likely to prevail if this case was under EU jurisdiction.
- inopinatus 6y ago
  Yes, my remark above was about EU fines applied to Microsoft. What might lead one to think it hasn't already attracted the interest of regulators outside the US? These battles are fought globally.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - username90 6y ago
    EU has already started an antitrust investigation into apples app store. Most likely they will get hit with a huge fine. > The European Commission has opened formal antitrust investigations to assess whether Apple's rules for app developers on the distribution of apps via the App Store violate EU competition rules. The investigations concern in particular the mandatory use of Apple's own proprietary in-app purchase system and restrictions on the ability of developers to inform iPhone and iPad users of alternative cheaper purchasing possibilities outside of apps. https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_20_1073 https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_20_...
- Xixi 6y ago
  I don't think iPhone/iOS market shares in the EU are high enough. I couldn't find a definitive source, but it seems to be somewhere between 14% [1] and 25% [2], the latter in the wealthier European markets. These numbers also include UK (I think), a traditionally strong market for Apple, but which should be out of EU Single Market by the end of the year. IANAL, but I don't think that's enough for Epic to have a case in the EU. On the other hand I could see the EU being more likely than the US to regulate these kind of stores, to try to protect European editors against Apple/Google. But the lobbying would have to come from European editors, not from Epic. [1] https://9to5mac.com/2019/08/12/iphone-market-share-in-europe/ https://9to5mac.com/2019/08/12/iphone-market-share-in-europe... [2] https://macdailynews.com/2020/01/29/iphone-takes-24-3-smartphone-share-across-five-major-eu-markets/ https://macdailynews.com/2020/01/29/iphone-takes-24-3-smartp...
  - inopinatus 6y ago
    This isn’t about device sales. The market in consideration is the $100bn/yr app-store market, of which Apple has 2/3 globally and around 55% of the European segment in 2019.