4 ms·

That is because the integration is not there in the linux ecosystem. Apple has this very tight integration because it controls both the hardware and the softwar

That is because the integration is not there in the linux ecosystem. Apple has this very tight integration because it controls both the hardware and the software. But there are some companies which have started doing the same thing: - System76 - Tuxedo These companies test their devices well on a distro and well, it reflects in their pricing too!

boogies 6y ago
Dell also sells an XPS “Developer Edition” with Ubuntu pre-installed and officially supported, and Lenovo recently announced a range of workstations and Thinkpads being certified to support Ubuntu and Fedora. There’s also Purism that created a custom PureOS to closely fit their custom hardware, eg. a TPM designed for user security instead of vendor lock-in.
- als0 6y ago
  > fit their custom hardware, eg. a TPM designed for user security instead of vendor lock-in. Just here to point out that they use a standard commercial off-the-shelf TPM manufactured by Infineon. It's not custom hardware. As with all TPMs, it is the firmware/OS that decides whether to use it for lock-in purposes or freedom.
  - boogies 6y ago
    I think the firmware is custom (and of course it’s the nexus of hardware and software, so exactly the part that OEMs can best provide the user unique value through. System76 and Pine64 (and I think Purism) provide open source firmware you can reflash yourself for custom keyboard layouts, firmware killswitches, etc., though System76’s hardware itself seems very off-the-self (Clevo white-label). (Edit: And I think Purism Librems overall design with hardware killswitches, etc. are custom ofc.)
- jessaustin 6y ago
  Lenovo talk a good game, but I have thus far been unable to find a linux laptop available for purchase on the lenovo site.
  - boogies 6y ago
    I don’t think they ship anything with it preinstalled right now (unlike each of the other companies I and the parent mentioned). But they’ve had a reputation of generally good Linux support for a while now, and it’s seems they’ve just now decided to make it official, and there’s plenty of hope for preinstalled GNU/Linux in the future.
    - wyclif 6y ago
      I'm hearing they will ship the P53 and a few other models with Fedora Workstation 32 by the end of the year: https://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonevangelho/2020/08/10/lenovo-new-thinkpad-p53-fedora-linux-laptop/#76f2d12719df https://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonevangelho/2020/08/10/lenov...
GekkePrutser 6y ago
No quite the same thing. None of the Linux vendors make their own laptops, they just use barebones from Clevo etc. So they can never achieve the same integration as Apple.
- boogies 6y ago
  > None of the Linux vendors make their own laptops Dell, Lenovo, Purism, Pine64 et al. do. The two in your parent may (at least System76’s laptops are said to) use Clevo hardware, but they can still ship with custom open source firmware. It’s also not as if Apple sells their own custom CPU at the moment. Even then, they’ll probably buy other parts from third parties (eg. they buy iPhone OLEDs from Samsung, though they’re said to calibrate them differently). And finally, integration can be seen as a bad thing. It’s conducive to lock in (see above comment on ARM Macs ending Hackintoshes).
  - GekkePrutser 6y ago
    Dell's Linux laptops are not custom made for linux (they even still have a Windows key!). They just swap out the wifi card. I'm pretty sure Purism's are just standard barebones too, but with some extra modifications like hardware switches. They showed how they solder the wires to the motherboard - if they'd designed it themselves they wouldn't have to do that. Pine64, indeed, that's true. The enclosure is standard (the PB Pro is the same as my Chinese "ChuWi" laptop :') ) but indeed they made a custom motherboard. I really like that company.

boogies 6y ago

Dell also sells an XPS “Developer Edition” with Ubuntu pre-installed and officially supported, and Lenovo recently announced a range of workstations and Thinkpads being certified to support Ubuntu and Fedora. There’s also Purism that created a custom PureOS to closely fit their custom hardware, eg. a TPM designed for user security instead of vendor lock-in.

als0 6y ago
> fit their custom hardware, eg. a TPM designed for user security instead of vendor lock-in. Just here to point out that they use a standard commercial off-the-shelf TPM manufactured by Infineon. It's not custom hardware. As with all TPMs, it is the firmware/OS that decides whether to use it for lock-in purposes or freedom.
- boogies 6y ago
  I think the firmware is custom (and of course it’s the nexus of hardware and software, so exactly the part that OEMs can best provide the user unique value through. System76 and Pine64 (and I think Purism) provide open source firmware you can reflash yourself for custom keyboard layouts, firmware killswitches, etc., though System76’s hardware itself seems very off-the-self (Clevo white-label). (Edit: And I think Purism Librems overall design with hardware killswitches, etc. are custom ofc.)
jessaustin 6y ago
Lenovo talk a good game, but I have thus far been unable to find a linux laptop available for purchase on the lenovo site.
- boogies 6y ago
  I don’t think they ship anything with it preinstalled right now (unlike each of the other companies I and the parent mentioned). But they’ve had a reputation of generally good Linux support for a while now, and it’s seems they’ve just now decided to make it official, and there’s plenty of hope for preinstalled GNU/Linux in the future.
  - wyclif 6y ago
    I'm hearing they will ship the P53 and a few other models with Fedora Workstation 32 by the end of the year: https://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonevangelho/2020/08/10/lenovo-new-thinkpad-p53-fedora-linux-laptop/#76f2d12719df https://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonevangelho/2020/08/10/lenov...

GekkePrutser 6y ago

No quite the same thing. None of the Linux vendors make their own laptops, they just use barebones from Clevo etc. So they can never achieve the same integration as Apple.

boogies 6y ago
> None of the Linux vendors make their own laptops Dell, Lenovo, Purism, Pine64 et al. do. The two in your parent may (at least System76’s laptops are said to) use Clevo hardware, but they can still ship with custom open source firmware. It’s also not as if Apple sells their own custom CPU at the moment. Even then, they’ll probably buy other parts from third parties (eg. they buy iPhone OLEDs from Samsung, though they’re said to calibrate them differently). And finally, integration can be seen as a bad thing. It’s conducive to lock in (see above comment on ARM Macs ending Hackintoshes).
- GekkePrutser 6y ago
  Dell's Linux laptops are not custom made for linux (they even still have a Windows key!). They just swap out the wifi card. I'm pretty sure Purism's are just standard barebones too, but with some extra modifications like hardware switches. They showed how they solder the wires to the motherboard - if they'd designed it themselves they wouldn't have to do that. Pine64, indeed, that's true. The enclosure is standard (the PB Pro is the same as my Chinese "ChuWi" laptop :') ) but indeed they made a custom motherboard. I really like that company.